A Question about the Clery Law at YOUR school...

Discussion in 'University & Campus Police' started by Kilvinsky, Mar 18, 2016.

  1. Kilvinsky

    Kilvinsky I think, therefore I'll never be promoted.

    Ok, so I'm curious about something. Those of us working at colleges and universities are quite familiar with the Clery Law and how important it is for the schools to make sure they get it right about the crime stats in their area. We also know that it makes our jobs a bit more secure. I stress the term, 'a bit' since we all know there are administrations out there who are just as dumb as a bag of rocks (I'm looking at DEAN!) and like to get by with little or nothing.

    But I'm off topic. My question is, just how detailed are your reports. When you do your incident reports, do you use the heading that fits Mass. Gen Laws or the UCRs.

    At my job, we are driven insane by the way our reports are gone over with a fine tooth comb. I'm not saying we'd all be sloppy if not for this micro management (we all tend to write pretty damn good reports) but there are times we say to ourselves and each other, "Seriously?"

    How much of a nitpicker is the person who does your stats and has the school ever lost a dime of federal money if they aren't? Just curious. Anyone? Anyone?
  2. mpd61

    mpd61 Federal Auxiliary Police

    Hey Jim......
    When was the last time you or I EVER heard of ANY school getting a "Clery Act Violation"?
    I doubt any school in New England ever got one. I think that there are so many reviews by Committees, VP's, Deans, and General Counsels' that much gets re-classified or even swept and under or unreported still.
    This is like the Barley-Fox gun law that nobody ever cites or uses...........

    Attached Files:

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  3. USM C-4

    USM C-4 MassCops Member

    They seem to fine a couple a year, on average. Still doesn't mean we don't nit pick, but fortunately we have a couple of the command staff who manage it. Our CAD does most of the heavy lifting, so we enter the criminal code and CAD creates the Clery record. I know it is a pain in the ass because I hear them complain about it... but it's an SEP (Someone Else's Problem) so I don't put any worry into it myself.

    It just gets done.... like magic...
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  4. Kilvinsky

    Kilvinsky I think, therefore I'll never be promoted.

    Our Clery guy is, well, he's a well loved and respected member of the department, civilian, non-sworn, never has been, and yet he's far more valuable than anyone in patrol. We've been told this in rather vague terms. We probably generate more reports than our municipal counterparts (on the surface, many seem frivolous, but I'm sure they're not), and that's fine, I don't mind writing 100 reports a night, the pay is the same, but we get them sent back for some crazy reasons and those who give thought to such things are convinced it's NOT so the reports look better, and all the necessary information is in there (99% of the time it IS), it's because he can send them back and no one is allowed to question it. A devilish game.

    But every time he's asked (and we're not allowed to converse with him-too many petty people have hurt his feelings) he justifies it as CLERY! No way around it. That's how it is, so deal.

    That's why I'm curious. I'm just bitching I guess. Whaaaaaah, right? :rolleyes:
  5. Kilvinsky

    Kilvinsky I think, therefore I'll never be promoted.

    Taken from another thread. I guess this could apply to ME!

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  6. mpd61

    mpd61 Federal Auxiliary Police

    Absolutely NOT buddy!!!!
    Some parents and students actually care, the media occasionally cares, and the ADMINISTRATION cares alot about not letting it out of control.

    So you keep right on asking those questions my brother!!!!
    BTW.....Did your department get those new rifles from SigSauer yet? o_O
  7. HistoryHound

    HistoryHound Supporting Member

    I had people in mind when I posted that, but none of the regulars here. Pretty sure you all have people around you that could use that though. God knows I do.
  8. Kilvinsky

    Kilvinsky I think, therefore I'll never be promoted.

    Whoa, sorry gang, I wasn't directing that at anyone here. That was a shot at where I work. You guys are the best.:)
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  9. fscpd907

    fscpd907 Subscribing Member

    I believe Roxbury Community College took big time hit a few years ago for numerous Clery Act reporting violations? Top admin types lost jobs and college paid huge fine well north of million dollars.

    Last edited: Apr 27, 2016
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  10. Kilvinsky

    Kilvinsky I think, therefore I'll never be promoted.

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  11. chienonline95

    chienonline95 New Member

    Some parents and students actually care, the media occasionally cares, and the ADMINISTRATION cares alot about not letting it out of control.
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  12. Kilvinsky

    Kilvinsky I think, therefore I'll never be promoted.

    Ain't that the truth. I know that HONESTY is PARAMOUNT, but I'm SURE that numbers still get a tad skewed now and then. It's human nature. I don't agree with it, but I have NO say and frankly, it seriously may not even happen where I work. But it is something that happens.

    I've gotten so few replies to this thread, I forget to check. Thanks for the reply chienonline95.
  13. NEPS

    NEPS MassCops Member

    Kilvinsky, I wonder what municipal police departments would look like if the Clery Act applied to cities and towns. I bet they would get fined all the time until they had a guy like your beloved Clery guy to keep the stats accurate and, well, honestly reported.
    As far as Clery violations... who knew that Title IX would ever mean that politically correct Hahvahd!!! would be investigated for Title IX violations.
    The hard truth is, you never know where a federal law is going to lead.
  14. Sgt Jack

    Sgt Jack Subscribing Member

    Our reports tend to disappear into a black hole of sorts and I'm not always sure this is always a good thing. OTHO I will say that over the years I've had a few reports come back for some pretty dumb crap but I was never told it had to do with Clery per se. I think sometimes that's just an easy excuse as college police culture in general is notorious for documenting inane shit that could be done with just a log entry.

    All that aside I do know our Management goes over the Clery numbers every year and even has a crime analyst come in to make sure that everything is good to go.

    Also like I've said before "Show me a Clery Report with all zeros and I'll show you someone falsifying their crime stats."
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  15. Kilvinsky

    Kilvinsky I think, therefore I'll never be promoted.

    Two kids get into an argument. One ends up punching the other. Turns out the victim of the assault is some protected group (regardless of what group that is, there's so damn many of them!) and before you know it, the first kid is charged with a HATE CRIME!!!! even if he had no clue OR the protected status did not figure in to the reason for the a and b.
    "Why did you hit him?"
    "He said my mother was a whore and I was a simple minded jerk. I shouldn't have, but he really just pushed my buttons."
    "He's (fill in the blank). You committed a hate crime."
    "Yeah, I hate him, I didn't realize hating someone was a crime if he just called your mother a whore."
    "No, you're a bigot."
    "WHAT? Oh come on, I didn't hit him because he's (fill in blank) hell, I didn't even KNOW he was (fill in blank)!!!"
    "Sorry punk. Oh, and we just learned you said, 'I could kill you.' Did you ever hear of Columbine? You're in BIG trouble now, punk."
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  16. NEPS

    NEPS MassCops Member

    Well, Kilv, the good fortune for your hypothetical victim of hate crime madness is that he was not alleged to have hurt an animal! #nothingisworsethanhurtingananimal--notevenhurtingahuman
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