# FID Question



## Unit7 (Oct 8, 2007)

Hello all, i am a Security Officer for Allied Barton with hopes to go into Law Enforcement, im also new to your forums.

My question, i was brought up on a 3 Felony charge case, 2 Larcenys over and a destruction of Pvt Prop over. The Dest of Pvt Prop was DISM befor the case ended. in the end i was givin 1 year probation with fines. i talked it down to 6 months of admin probation, CWOF with just fees. now all of my charges read DISM. no convictions. i do know that a CWOF will disqualify for 5 years, but thats not my current disposition.

Will this hamper my ability to obtain my FID? Yes i have my Hunters Ed Cert from 2003.


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## misconceived (Jun 18, 2006)

:-\"


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## Big.G (Nov 28, 2006)

Straight from the FID/LTC application:



> 10. HAVE YOU EVER APPEARED IN ANY COURT AS A DEFENDANT FOR ANY CRIMINAL OFFENSE (EXCLUDING NONCRIMINAL TRAFFIC OFFENSES)?​


So I would say yea, you will have a lot of trouble getting an FID since you would have to answer yes to that question per:




> *WARNING* ANY PERSON WHO KNOWINGLY FILES AN APPLICATION CONTAINING FALSE INFORMATION SHALL BE PUNISHED BY A FINE OF NOT LESS THAN $500 NOR MORE THAN $1,000 OR BY IMPRISONMENT FOR NOT LESS THAN 6 MONTHS NOR MORE THAN 2 YEARS IN A HOUSE OF CORRECTION, OR BY BOTH SUCH FINE AND IMPRISONMENT (M.G.L. c.140, § 131).


​


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## Unit7 (Oct 8, 2007)

again, it as 6 months of Admin with a COWF. then a DISM.


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## 94c (Oct 21, 2005)

you're a thief. just steal one.


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## csauce777 (Jan 10, 2005)

:l:



Unit7 said:


> Hello all, i am a Security Officer for Allied Barton with hopes to go into Law Enforcement.
> 
> My question, i was brought up on a 3 Felony charge case, 2 Larcenys over and a destruction of Pvt Prop over.


:L:

Is this a joke? If it is, you have a better chance in the stand up comedy field...


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## Unit7 (Oct 8, 2007)

there are people that are convicted with penility les then 2 years and they can still apply, im just askin here. im not lookin to get flamed.


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## Killjoy (Jun 23, 2003)

> there are people that are convicted with penility les then 2 years and they can still apply, im just askin here. im not lookin to get flamed.


 I'm writing you a summons for Chapter 22-Section 3,* failure to use capitals and proper punctuation in a post.* Additionally I'm also issuing a civil cite Chapter 78 for *failure to use spellcheck in an open forum.*


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## Tuna (Jun 1, 2006)

Forget about the FID, I'm surprised you have a job in security


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## copcreamer (Dec 3, 2004)

I'm sure Allied Barton would appreciate the "badvertising". But then again, who would know more about security than a criminal (i.e. you)


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## KozmoKramer (Apr 25, 2004)

Tuna you are far too kind, I'm surprised he can tie his own shoes.
My head hurts after reading that drivel.

Killjoy - don't let him plea that down...


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## JLT770 (Jun 7, 2007)

so the moral of the story here is if you have ever gone before a court on any charges you will have trouble obtaining an FID? this is bad news for someone who wants a LTC...and to become a police officer im guessing then...


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## 94c (Oct 21, 2005)

JLT770 said:


> so the moral of the story here is if you have ever gone before a court on any charges you will have trouble obtaining an FID? this is bad news for someone who wants a LTC...and to become a police officer im guessing then...


It's supposed to be bad news. We don't need any thieves on this job.


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## Big.G (Nov 28, 2006)

Unit7 said:


> again, it as 6 months of Admin with a COWF. then a DISM.


Thank you, Sir. I can read. Can you?



JLT770 said:


> so the moral of the story here is if you have ever gone before a court on any charges you will have trouble obtaining an FID? this is bad news for someone who wants a LTC...and to become a police officer im guessing then...


Sounds like it now that you mention it. A Chief's discretion would be very useful if you live in the right town.

Unit7, take your Hunter Ed and buy a hunting license, MassWildlife could really use the money. Then buy a bow or a muzzleloader. If you go the muzzleloader route, get a buddy that has an FID to buy you the blackpowder/pyrodex, bullets, and primers/percussion caps since you don't need an FID to possess them, just to buy them. I have some serious doubts about you getting your FID with those charges regardless if they were dismissed. Did you read that article recently in the Boston Herald where 12 gangbangers had charges of violent crimes dismissed because the police officers were never summonsed to court. Your dismissal doesn't mean shit to me and probably won't mean shit to whoever processes your FID application.


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## justanotherparatrooper (Aug 27, 2006)

Unit 7..ignore that part about having someone else buy powder/pyrodex for you.If your serious, talk to a attorney because I have a better chance of hitting Mass Millions then you do of getting an FID card. Get used to hunting with a bow.


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## 94c (Oct 21, 2005)

Unit7 said:


> there are people that are convicted with *penility* les then 2 years and they can still apply, im just askin here. im not lookin to get flamed.


I'm not into medical terms but....

Is that some kind of sexually transmitted disease?


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## JLT770 (Jun 7, 2007)

well im no thief thats for sure, but i don't need an FID card, just dont want or need a CWOF on possession of alcohol as a minor under 21 to come back and haunt me.


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## Unit7 (Oct 8, 2007)

resqjyw0 said:


> Thank you, Sir. I can read. Can you?
> 
> Sounds like it now that you mention it. A Chief's discretion would be very useful if you live in the right town.
> 
> Unit7, take your Hunter Ed and buy a hunting license, MassWildlife could really use the money. Then buy a bow or a muzzleloader. If you go the muzzleloader route, get a buddy that has an FID to buy you the blackpowder/pyrodex, bullets, and primers/percussion caps since you don't need an FID to possess them, just to buy them. I have some serious doubts about you getting your FID with those charges regardless if they were dismissed. Did you read that article recently in the Boston Herald where 12 gangbangers had charges of violent crimes dismissed because the police officers were never summonsed to court. *Your dismissal doesn't mean shit to me and probably won't mean shit to whoever processes your FID application*.


So you believe in, Guilty until found Innocent? It's a good thing that we live in America.


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## TacOps (Nov 28, 2006)

Unit7 said:


> again, it as 6 months of Admin with a COWF. then a DISM.


Yeah, we noticed that the first time you posted it. Why don't you learn to read.

Quote:
10. HAVE YOU EVER APPEARED IN ANY COURT AS A DEFENDANT FOR ANY CRIMINAL OFFENSE (EXCLUDING NONCRIMINAL TRAFFIC OFFENSES)?​
I don't care if your case was"DISM" you still appeared in court.

I am not at all surprised this goon got a job working security, they hire felons all the time. Not only is this gonna hinder your FID application, but your gonna have a hard time getting on a police department. It's not so much the actual crime, it's the fact that you would do that. Yeah, like the others have said, go steal one. Or better yet, just go steal a handgun, then you don't even have to worry about the card.


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## Big.G (Nov 28, 2006)

Unit7 said:


> there are people that are convicted with penility les then 2 years and they can still apply, im just askin here.


Nobody said you can't apply. Go ahead and pay the $100. You'll probably get rejected just like those people you refer to probably do.


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## justanotherparatrooper (Aug 27, 2006)

So you believe in, Guilty until found Innocent? It's a good thing that we live in America.
*CWOF and dismisal are NOT the same thing as being found innocent and whatever LE you deal with knows that. LIe on an application and you will get caught whether it's for an fid card or police dept application....*


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## Tuna (Jun 1, 2006)

Koz K. thanks for the comment and your right. Sometimes I just feel sorry for certain individuals. I never take a punch at a handicapped person without just cause. So far this guy is just proving that he is a nitwit. No malice, just a nitwit.](*,)


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## Big.G (Nov 28, 2006)

Unit7 said:


> So you believe in, Guilty until found Innocent?


Hey you finally picked up on something!!! That's the way our court systems work. Get used to it. Even if you ended up with a not guilty, it's not the same as innocent. It just means there wasn't enough against you to have a guilty finding.

What I was saying before about those gangbangers is that their charges were dismissed for a BS reason, someone didn't do their job in summonsing the police officers. What's to say that your charges were dismissed because of some BS reason. Unless the Police Officer prosecuting you dropped the charges against you, I will continue to believe you are guilty even though it can't/hasn't been proven.

CWOF ≠ innocent
Dismissal ≠ innocent
Not guilty ≠ innocent

Innocent = Innocent

Just face it. You screwed up. You're not going to get an FID card. You're not going to become a Police Officer if you can't get a FID or LTC. That's the way life goes.


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## 94c (Oct 21, 2005)

JLT770 said:


> well im no thief thats for sure, but i don't need an FID card, just dont want or need a CWOF on possession of alcohol as a minor under 21 to come back and haunt me.


That's a far cry from 2 Felony Larcenies and a Felony Damage to Property. Courts dump cases every day without informing the cops.

I would love to hear the scenario that led to this guy's charges.

Maybe it was something innocent like two snowblowers jumping into the back of his truck when he wasn't looking.

I file a motion to hear the facts of the case and let the MassCops jury decide.


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## JLT770 (Jun 7, 2007)

well thats good to hear 94c, but yeah im surprised he even got into security, theres people at my company that get fired when their BG comes back, funny they let them work until then, but hey its security...hurting for anyone it seems.


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## Nightstalker (Jul 25, 2006)

94c said:


> I'm not into medical terms but....
> 
> Is that some kind of sexually transmitted disease?


94c... is that whats causing you rash? :moon:


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## 94c (Oct 21, 2005)

no, it's from running naked through the woods.


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## Minion (Nov 24, 2006)

With all due respect to the officers on this forum, this question is something I am interested in as well. Some of you may remember me from a while back, I had a crazy ex-gf who threatened my life, damaged my property, tried to break into my home etc. I had to get a restraining order against her.

In retaliation, she tried to get a 209A against me - got an emergency one b/c she made up some ridiculous story. The officers gave her one because they pretty much give emergency 209A's to anyone provided the story seems compelling enough. They don't want to be held liable for anything that could happen, and I understand that.

I never had an order against me per say, the emer 209A was never continued/extended. But the one I got against my ex was.

Would this type of situation disqualify me from getting an FID?

I'm not guilty of anything except dating someone who was chemically imbalanced... so please don't treat me like a criminal. I am a law-abiding citizen and I support my local PD every year.


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## Big.G (Nov 28, 2006)

> 12. ARE YOU NOW OR HAVE YOU EVER BEEN THE SUBJECT OF A M.G.L. c. 209A RESTRAINING ORDER OR INVOLVED IN A
> DOMESTIC VIOLENCE CHARGE?


The only real answer is the one from the CLEO in your town that you would be applying through. But answering "yes" to that question makes the chance of getting one almost non-existant.


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## SOT (Jul 30, 2004)

An FID is shall issue unless you meet one of the disqualifying events. As you are not PRESENTLY a subject of a restraining order, you CAN NOT be denied.
Technically you can't be denied for the Class A/B either but it gets more into the suitable person thing, and a Class A/B is a MAY issue.

You should answer YES on 12, then you would explain. If denied, report it to goal.org and take the CLEO to court, you will win as the law is very clear.

http://www.goal.org/misc/faq/structure.pdf

http://www.goal.org/PDF/disqual.pdf

http://www.goal.org/PDF/FID.pdf


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## 94c (Oct 21, 2005)

SOT is right again when it comes to guns.

If the order is dropped they have to give it to you unless they play the suitability angle.

You have 90 days to appeal to District Court on a denial involving a 209a


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## vaspo (Sep 7, 2007)

I have a question about FID/ LTC. I am a resident of VA and am currently in the job down there. I attend Mass Maritime and am in the Police Academy at Plymouth. I was wondering what the procedure would be for a person on the job trying to get an FID/LTC since I am out of state. Would I have to go through the MSP Licensing and Certification Division or through my local PD?


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## SOT (Jul 30, 2004)

To what end? 
For the average joe the following rules apply:
Out of state, apply to the MSP for the license, it's $100 a year.
MA does not recognize any other state CCP, so applying to your local department in VA will do nothing for you, save maybe meet some requirement that you have a local CCP in order to obtain a MA CCP (which I'm not sure is a requirement).
Also understand that if you are trying to tie it to some sort of work issue, the average joe would need a letter from said employer to prove as such. Not really needed for out of state people as the MSP will issue Class A ALP pretty much outright so long as you are not disqualified for another reason...(or at least they used to)
But like that Wolfman says, wouldn't HR218 apply?

Anybody know what happened with that one retired guy and HR218? Did he carry, what happened?



vaspo said:


> I have a question about FID/ LTC. I am a resident of VA and am currently in the job down there. I attend Mass Maritime and am in the Police Academy at Plymouth. I was wondering what the procedure would be for a person on the job trying to get an FID/LTC since I am out of state. Would I have to go through the MSP Licensing and Certification Division or through my local PD?


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## vaspo (Sep 7, 2007)

HR 218 doesn't apply because I am not on with a municipal department. I was on a private police/ security department. But I am currently going through the academy up here and I know that having a Class A and an LTC is required by pretty much all of the departments for liability reasons. I was wondering, If i got on the job up here, if I would have to go through the Chief, like everyone else, or if I would have to go through MSP.


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## vaspo (Sep 7, 2007)

Wolfman said:


> Ah. When you first said you were on the job I thought you meant you were a cop, not a security guard. Maybe the connotation of the term is different in VA.:sq:


I am a sworn cop. I happen to work for a department that is for private property and we alos hire rent-a- cops. Thanks though. I have full arrest authority as any other officer on the job, to include motor vehicle law.


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## SOT (Jul 30, 2004)

If you get a job up here you would go through the town you live in for the Class A. If that town also happens to be the town you work in, then it would be obviously the same.


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## Rocco39 (Jul 13, 2007)

I hope you don't plan on carrying at the Academy (mass maritime that is). You must be planning on carrying off campus right? Otherwise you're asking for trouble, LTC or not. BTW Deck or Engineering?


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## vaspo (Sep 7, 2007)

Rocco39 said:


> I hope you don't plan on carrying at the Academy (mass maritime that is). You must be planning on carrying off campus right? Otherwise you're asking for trouble, LTC or not. BTW Deck or Engineering?


I wouldn't want to even think about what kind of problems that would cause. My duty weapon would be locked away at the department, unless given express permission from the academy. I am in the Emergency Management/ Homeland Security major. The LTC/FID is mainly if I get on with a department up here. I am trying to get reserve/ part-time status with a department.


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## Minion (Nov 24, 2006)

Thanks for the info SOT

After reading the PDF's it looks like I wouldn't be disqualified from getting an FID or a LTC. I would be interested in getting a handgun to keep in my home and to take to the local range.

It appears the FID cards don't cover handguns, only shotguns and rifles. Is that right?

The Goal PDF and FID PDF are sort of in disagreement. The FID PDF says an FID covers handguns in the home provided they were bought with a temporary permit to purchase. But the structure PDF clearly shows that only rifles and shotguns are covered (as well as mace/pepper spray).

What's a temporary permit to purchase? And what does "covered in the home" mean? Does that mean I couldn't take the handgun out of the house at all - like to a local firing range?


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## SOT (Jul 30, 2004)

There is some debate about that issue, and it is a good point to bring up FID/Handgun/Class A.

I would suggest the following:
A handgun is useless without ammo. Unless you have a rifle caliber handgun, then you will always need the Class A.

I teach (and maybe wrongly so based on some of that info) that you can not own a handgun, rifle, or shotgun without a license that is commiserate with the type of gun you own - Not in your home or otherwise. 
I think in the "old days" prior to '98 you could own anything with no license, then the posses and purchase changes came into play, then they have been modified over the years.
As it stands now FID is non-large capacity rifles and shotguns - purchase and posses. 
Class A is for rifles, pistols, shotguns, large capacity or not purchase or posses.
The Class B is very rare, and most will just issue a Class A, with restrictions if need.
Understand that you may technically qualify for a Class A, but basically the discretion for the issuance lies with the CLEO.

I don't think that the temporary purchase permits even exist any longer, that was the old style purchase permit which has now been superseded by the new laws post 1998.


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## jgreen902 (Aug 21, 2007)

Yes, I agree. I think you might have a little trouble getting an FID. I would ask and make sure your court appearances won't interfere with getting into LE.


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## Upstanding Citizen (Feb 6, 2014)

See, this is the most terrifying part of our legal system. Unfortunately there just isn't an adequate I.Q. test for prospective cops. I mean these buffoons are actually handed guns and released upon society. The difference between the legislative and military branches is totally lost on them. Apply for an F.I.D. and when these morons try to deny you take them to court. Many if not most of them have gotten away with more than you might think, simply because instead of becoming productive members of society they became podunk cops. Don't believe them for a second if they claim they've never been caught leaving a bar after a few too many drinks. Or that they've never been in a fist fight. Or that they've never been heard to have an overzealous argument with a girlfriend. The difference is that when real people make a mistake it goes on their record for life; when cops make a mistake it gets hushed up. No, Officer Townie of your local P.D. does not have the right to negate the Second Amendment of the U.S. constitution just because you were accused of a crime once and not found guilty. That's asinine. It's easier for them to do it here in The People's Republic of Massachusetts, but no, they do not have that right, and I strongly encourage you to push back.


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## Johnny Law (Aug 8, 2008)

Roger Fowler Jr from Ipswich, who's the buffoon resurrecting a SIX year old thread to get in a few cheap shots? You're an even bigger douche for being so easy to track down. All street level cops have no say in who gets issued or not. And there are three branches of government: executive, legislative and judicial. There is no military branch, although there are branches of the military. Now go eat a bag of dicks.


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## Johnny Law (Aug 8, 2008)

No response? Must be busy shooting your cockholster off at NES.


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## Joel98 (Mar 2, 2011)

Upstanding Citizen said:


> See, this is the most terrifying part of our legal system. Unfortunately there just isn't an adequate I.Q. test for prospective cops. I mean these buffoons are actually handed guns and released upon society. The difference between the legislative and military branches is totally lost on them. Apply for an F.I.D. and when these morons try to deny you take them to court. Many if not most of them have gotten away with more than you might think, simply because instead of becoming productive members of society they became podunk cops. Don't believe them for a second if they claim they've never been caught leaving a bar after a few too many drinks. Or that they've never been in a fist fight. Or that they've never been heard to have an overzealous argument with a girlfriend. The difference is that when real people make a mistake it goes on their record for life; when cops make a mistake it gets hushed up. No, Officer Townie of your local P.D. does not have the right to negate the Second Amendment of the U.S. constitution just because you were accused of a crime once and not found guilty. That's asinine. It's easier for them to do it here in The People's Republic of Massachusetts, but no, they do not have that right, and I strongly encourage you to push back.


Wow....you just resurrected a 6 year old thread, it must be nice to have all the time in the world to scroll through threads everyday, not having a job and living in your moms basement smoking weed.

Get a life and get a job....


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## kwflatbed (Dec 29, 2004)

Another A-HOLE bits the dust


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## Bloodhound (May 20, 2010)

Douche

Oh, and Joel, he doesn't sit in his parents basement smoking weed. He bought the house from them in 2008 for a dollar, so I guess it's his house now. Oh the internets...


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## Dan Stark (Aug 2, 2005)

Nice Capris Douche. 

Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk


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## Johnny Law (Aug 8, 2008)

Sweet 'stache bro. Napoleon Dynamite and kiddie diddler approved


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## USM C-2 (Oct 27, 2010)

Dan Stark said:


> Nice Capris Douche.
> 
> Sent from my XT907 using Tapatalk


No, no... Those are clam diggers. He's plainly standing in the clam flats. The rainbow clam flats.

Not that there's anything wrong with that.

I'm sure his clam rake and bucket are just out of the photo.


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## mpd61 (Aug 7, 2002)

Somebody wanna tell me what this tool's user name is over at NES?


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