# Band scoring system for civil service



## 4198

I received my Firefighter exam score today from the exam dated 6/10/06. 

There is a new system of exam scoring. 

I don't know if this type scoring has been used before or if anyone here knows anything about it but it's called "band scoring'" where they lump scores together in 9 different bands? 

eg. band 1 is below 70 (fail) 
band 2 is between 70-71 
band 3 between 72-75 
band 4 between 76-79 and so forth all the way up. 

So, I will never know my actual score except that it was band 8, which is between 92 and 95, (the last highest band is 9 scores between 96-100) it seems good and bad, say you scored a 96 well now your in with the 100's cool! but if you scored 100 your dragged down to the 96's. it will be interesting.


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## PBiddy35

Banding seems to make sense. That would take away a little cs nonsense, it gives a little less value to each individual point and lumps people as good better and best qualified.


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## 4198

I believe this system is the result of lawsuits filed in Federal court in 2002 & 2004 involving (Lynn Fire Department) and minorities.


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## chief801

Better system, but don't kid yourselves boys...this test does not mean your qualified! It is a half-assed test written to a 10th grade proficiency level...pat yourselves on the back if you got a 100%, it means NOTHING! I love my job, my co-workers, etc, but remeber... 19 y.o.a., a driver's license, and no felonies... = cop in MA. Until we up the ante, we'll never be taken seriously as a profession.


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## Guest

everyone is taking the same test....the questions are all the same, everyone signs up for the same, so score it the way its scored... numerically, give vets and 402A/B candidates preference and go from there. PERIOD. Everyone knows that these tests do not judge how well a police officer or firefighter someone will be.

Does a finance degree make anyone qualified to become a senior financial advisor at a fidelity....no but it may get me in the door, and then I will learn that companies specific policies, there specific computer applications, and how to actually do the job with on the job training. Just like these tests.....it gets you in the door if its your day, then you go through the process, then if your lucky enough to get into a police or fire academy you learn how to do THE JOB, even then you learn the job when you on patrol or on a firetruck. 

bottom line is everyone takes the same test, with the same answer sheet and the same answers to choose from. How many people would even be qualified to take the test if the test was based on strictly on fire science, chemistry, suppression, EMT coursework?


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## alphadog1

CHIEF801...You need to be 21 YOA to take the police civil service exam in MA. This changed because of the LTC requirement.


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## chief801

alphadog1 said:


> CHIEF801...You need to be 21 YOA to take the police civil service exam in MA. This changed because of the LTC requirement.


You are correct...I've just been using that line since before the change. I stand corrected!


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## DVET1979

Band scoring is stupid. A pecking order needs to be established somehow. Although I do agree the test that is administered (the 2004 test which I took) had nothing to do with firefighting, it does take basic skills such as being able to read, write, and comprehend complex situations into consideration.


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## 4198

DVET1979 said:


> Band scoring is stupid. A pecking order needs to be established somehow. Although I do agree the test that is administered (the 2004 test which I took) had nothing to do with firefighting, it does take basic skills such as being able to read, write, and comprehend complex situations into consideration.


It's far from stupid and the pecking order is being established by the exam.

The only difference is it's a process that lumps groups people with "like scores" together giving the actual number to the written exam score a little less weight and giving more people a chance to shine in the interview for the job, but if you fall on the interview and mess that up well nothings going to save you and walk up to hand you a job anyways even with a high score.

We all know high scores don't prove you can do the job, the way someone handles pressure on a written exam vs. in real life situations can be quite different.


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## misconceived

chief801 said:


> 19 y.o.a., a driver's license, and no felonies... = cop in MA.


Chief, can you tell me where in MA? I am a WHITE, male in my 20's, with 5 generations of law enforcement behind me. Despite high scores on the previous 2 exams I can't catch a break. Civil service needs to change.


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## kwflatbed

In plain english Civil Circus SUCKS !!

It has sucked since the early 1960's when the first liberal changes
started.

Today the white male is the minority in the testing no matter
what you read in the papers.

The only fair testing is on the knowledge for the job that you
want, with the hiring of the person done by thier scores but this 
will never happen again in liberal Assachusetts.

What makes one person better than another its not thier sex or
color. They study and do thier best, not cry that things are unfair.

Unfair is liberals changing laws that never should have been changed.


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## DVET1979

4198 said:


> It's far from stupid and the pecking order is being established by the exam.
> 
> The only difference is it's a process that lumps groups people with "like scores" together giving the actual number to the written exam score a little less weight and giving more people a chance to shine in the interview for the job, but if you fall on the interview and mess that up well nothings going to save you and walk up to hand you a job anyways even with a high score.
> 
> We all know high scores don't prove you can do the job, the way someone handles pressure on a written exam vs. in real life situations can be quite different.


Next they'll just make the test pass/fail the way things are going.


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## TPD

Anyone know what will happen with Vet, D/Vet and 402 statuses with this new grading. Will someone whos a D/Vet with a score of 90 still be at the top of the list or just at the top of there respective number group?


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## max

I would think so. That test seemed more like a psych eval. It is a miracle I passed. I wonder if the police will take a similar test. It was one of those tests where you had no idea how you scored.


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## testtaker

chief801 said:


> Better system, but don't kid yourselves boys...this test does not mean your qualified! It is a half-assed test written to a 10th grade proficiency level...pat yourselves on the back if you got a 100%, it means NOTHING! I love my job, my co-workers, etc, but remeber... 19 y.o.a., a driver's license, and no felonies... = cop in MA. Until we up the ante, we'll never be taken seriously as a profession.


It amazes me..... I am sick of hearing from cops or cop wannabe's about how unfair the test is. To be a job it is simple, take it from me. I have no family "in the job" I had no friends "on the job". I had no political connections. You know how I got the job - hard work. I am from "today's generation" of which love to use that as an excuse.

To get a job you need to do the following:

1) commitment - that means you need to want to be a police officer for more than 1 year and you work to try to get it. The test is every two years and it will take several years to get hired deal with it. If your want to be a doctor it will take a couple years too. While you wait apply at the DPW and become a garbage collector, it will get you used to the smell.

2) Take the damn test - it is a easy test - I should know I took the entrance , and made top three in EVERY pomotional exam up to chief - key to the tests - BE PREPARED

3) volunteer, omg yes work for (i hate to say it) FREE - get to know the officers - don't drink :beer: with them - work with them - don't act like an ass

4) comit to a community - live in a civil service community - live means LIVE, not just move there to get the job - get to know the community and - umm volunteer (for free) to help to community you want to serve - get to know the people of the community, get your name out there.

5) go to school - almost everyone is a HS grad, get you Assoc, Bach or Masters - most towns will pay you back 100 times the value of school. In a quinn bill town a masters degree on a $50,000 salary for 30 years is worth $375,000 Get your degree in Criminal Justice - it shows that you actually want to be a police officer not an accountant.....

6) have a.... I don't know how to explain it, a ummm CLEAN record - not a perfect record, but don't expect to act like an ass to cops in college, get picked up for being an a$$ during the nightime hours and expect that you will be totally forgiven. A lengthy motor vehicle record shows that you are unable to control yourself.

7) Try to get your reserve itn academy done. training or any other type of police/security training. You might have to do it for FREE, you may have to actually pay for it

8) Join the service - your will be amazed how fast you go to the top of the list for that!! A resident that is a veteran is number 1 on the list my friend, that it the way it is, if that is not you, you have more work ahead if you, he/she worked for it so should you.

9) Be prepared for the entrance requirements, do research on the department for your oral interview and be physically fit.

Yes, kids the job is not for everyone,it is not easy to get, we want it that way, just because you can take a test does not mean your qualified for the job.

And, frankly I am sick of hearing from the chiefs how bad Civil Service is, If your a chief from a CS town and you bitch about how bad the selection is, your definitely making a statement on the quality of your officers, of whom are all civil servants. Time and time again I hear from chiefs on how they want a candidate, but civil service got in the way - why is that could your "great candidiate" not pass the 10th grade test? Is your "Great candidate" not a resident in the town that he wants to serve? There is VERY little recruitment in this state - that is why we get substandard candidates.

Chief, do you have a degree requirment in your department, if not, you are also part of the problem of our profession - recruit more and hire better!!

Well thats my two cents


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## chief801

testtaker said:


> It amazes me..... I am sick of hearing from cops or cop wannabe's about how unfair the test is. To be a job it is simple, take it from me. I have no family "in the job" I had no friends "on the job". I had no political connections. You know how I got the job - hard work. I am from "today's generation" of which love to use that as an excuse.
> 
> To get a job you need to do the following:
> 
> 1) commitment - that means you need to want to be a police officer for more than 1 year and you work to try to get it. The test is every two years and it will take several years to get hired deal with it. If your want to be a doctor it will take a couple years too. While you wait apply at the DPW and become a garbage collector, it will get you used to the smell.
> 
> 2) Take the damn test - it is a easy test - I should know I took the entrance , and made top three in EVERY pomotional exam up to chief - key to the tests - BE PREPARED
> 
> 3) volunteer, omg yes work for (i hate to say it) FREE - get to know the officers - don't drink :beer: with them - work with them - don't act like an ass
> 
> 4) comit to a community - live in a civil service community - live means LIVE, not just move there to get the job - get to know the community and - umm volunteer (for free) to help to community you want to serve - get to know the people of the community, get your name out there.
> 
> 5) go to school - almost everyone is a HS grad, get you Assoc, Bach or Masters - most towns will pay you back 100 times the value of school. In a quinn bill town a masters degree on a $50,000 salary for 30 years is worth $375,000 Get your degree in Criminal Justice - it shows that you actually want to be a police officer not an accountant.....
> 
> 6) have a.... I don't know how to explain it, a ummm CLEAN record - not a perfect record, but don't expect to act like an ass to cops in college, get picked up for being an a$$ during the nightime hours and expect that you will be totally forgiven. A lengthy motor vehicle record shows that you are unable to control yourself.
> 
> 7) Try to get your reserve itn academy done. training or any other type of police/security training. You might have to do it for FREE, you may have to actually pay for it
> 
> 8) Join the service - your will be amazed how fast you go to the top of the list for that!! A resident that is a veteran is number 1 on the list my friend, that it the way it is, if that is not you, you have more work ahead if you, he/she worked for it so should you.
> 
> 9) Be prepared for the entrance requirements, do research on the department for your oral interview and be physically fit.
> 
> Yes, kids the job is not for everyone,it is not easy to get, we want it that way, just because you can take a test does not mean your qualified for the job.
> 
> And, frankly I am sick of hearing from the chiefs how bad Civil Service is, If your a chief from a CS town and you bitch about how bad the selection is, your definitely making a statement on the quality of your officers, of whom are all civil servants. Time and time again I hear from chiefs on how they want a candidate, but civil service got in the way - why is that could your "great candidiate" not pass the 10th grade test? Is your "Great candidate" not a resident in the town that he wants to serve? There is VERY little recruitment in this state - that is why we get substandard candidates.
> 
> Chief, do you have a degree requirment in your department, if not, you are also part of the problem of our profession - recruit more and hire better!!
> 
> Well thats my two cents


We do have a degree requirement. We are not C.S., and I am extremely happy with our personnel. The complaints you hear from other chief's generally don't apply to the majority of their officers. They stem from the couple of "problem children" they were forced to hire by civil service who they would have never hired if they were given more discretion. Let's face it, any chief's success or job stability is greatly dependent on the quality of candidates they hire. That being said, I think it is only fair to give chief's the final say in who they hire, since that person may directly impact the chief's and department's future. Policing is like pro sports. They don't can the players when you are losing, they fire the manager!


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## DVET1979

Testtaker- although I up being a jake, I do applaud your formula for all these young guys out there. It took me 8 years to get where I am today. I knew I wanted to do police or fire work way back when I was in high school. The clock starts for everyone at age 19 for prospective firefighters and 21 for prospective police officers. I am not saying everyone but there are too many people out there who want the job and dont want to put in the time and effort to get there.


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## kwflatbed

2) "Take the damn test - it is a easy test - I should know I took the entrance , and made top three in EVERY pomotional exam up to chief - key to the tests - BE PREPARED"


This is the problem with CS it is an easy test it's not on the job knowledge,
if it was job orientated it would weed out the I'm just a test takers, and
leave a pool of qualified people not just test takers.


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## testtaker

Quoting chief:

We do have a degree requirement. =D>

The complaints you hear from other chief's generally don't apply to the majority of their officers. They stem from the couple of "problem children" they were forced to hire by civil service who they would have never hired if they were given more discretion. Then fire them..... Who doesn't have the 20% of problem children - that's just an excuse. The next excuse is that Civil Service makes it too hard to fired them ... wrong... The chief just needs to be prepared and document the problem. Many chief fail to do so, so they are stuck.

Let's face it, any chief's success or job stability is greatly dependent on the quality of candidates they hire. That being said, I think it is only fair to give chief's the final say in who they hire, They do, all they need is a reason, like a COMPREHENSIVE Background check, oral interviews since that person may directly impact the chief's and department's future. Policing is like pro sports. They don't can the players when you are losing, they fire the manager! Or they get transferred, like Bill Parcels????

Chiefs are no different than anyone else, they want the free ride with all the power. Hiring is one of the MOST improtant jobs of a chief, I agree, but how they don't like to have a rule book. Like pro sports, you need to work hard to get the job, not be the coaches friend - that is where they put the managers


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## testtaker

testtaker said:


> Policing is like pro sports. They don't can the players when you are losing, they fire the manager!


The more and more I think about this analogy the more I like it.

Pro sport athletes - start practicing thier sport at a VERY young age. They know what they want and they work for it, at first for free. They go to training camps (part-time academy) when they are young. Most of them go to college, while there they "practice thier sports consantly" (police should go to school and be "clean") and volunteer to get thier name known. Of course, there is always the Ocho cincos, but they are flashes in the pan - big name today - who are they tomorrow. We should look for the Dan Marino's - May not win all they games, but is a consistent winner, both on the field and off the field.

Pro-Coaches and agencies - pay big bucks for recruitment - they don't wait for the athlete to come to them. They pay thier athletes what their worth. They fire the athletes that don't work out. And they constantly TRAIN those athlete to keep them in their best condition. They also "trade" (or in case of PD's "steal") the best players from other teams.

You want the best, it costs money (thankfully, cops don't demand as much money as athletes) but it still cost money to RECRUIT, to TRAIN and RETAIN.

I love your analogy - it does seem to work. =D>


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## testtaker

kwflatbed said:


> This is the problem with CS it is an easy test it's not on the job knowledge,
> if it was job orientated it would weed out the I'm just a test takers, and
> leave a pool of qualified people not just test takers.


This is NOT a problem.... the enterence exam is just that, for entry level. No expierence needed, the job orientated exams are promotional exams, I'll get to that in a minute. The entry level exam is a commonsense test, people don't like to hear it, but if you fail it, your lacking commonsense. Commonsense is THE most important part of a police officer.

To prepare for an entry level exam, research other exams, READ the prep guide, know how to take an exam (don't leave questions blank), talk to others who took it (yes, it may entail you actually speaking to a police officer) get some good sleep and eat well. Partying the night before is not preparing for an improtant lifetime test.

Promotional tests, I am sick and tire of people accusing others of being good "test-takers", hense my name - You know why I am a good test-taker.... I STUDY - yes more than a couple hours the night before the exam. I constantly study to keep up with trends, laws, and management styles. It is constant and not "just for the exam". I examine and research the postion that I would like to obtain WORK for it. The people who bitch about the exam, are those who did not study - those who project their failures onto the successes of others, I hope that is not you!


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## kwflatbed

testtaker said:


> This is NOT a problem.... the enterence exam is just that, for entry level. No expierence needed, the job orientated exams are promotional exams, I'll get to that in a minute. The entry level exam is a commonsense test, people don't like to hear it, but if you fail it, your lacking commonsense. Commonsense is THE most important part of a police officer.


You sound just like every leftest liberal out there,you want to be a plumber you study plumbing,you want to be an electrician you study for that,you want to be a cop or firefighter you study for that. You do not take a general knowledge test geared toward people that can not pass a test geared to the job you want.

Could you have got on the job if you had to take the old style of testing on the blue
or red book ?? I doubt it to much work to pass the test.

It takes a hell of a lot more than commonsense to be a good police officer!!!!!


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## testtaker

kwflatbed said:


> You sound just like every leftest liberal out there,you want to be a plumber you study plumbing,you want to be an electrician you study for that,you want to be a cop or firefighter you study for that. You do not take a general knowledge test geared toward people that can not pass a test geared to the job you want.
> 
> Could you have got on the job if you had to take the old style of testing on the blue
> or red book ?? I doubt it to much work to pass the test.
> 
> It takes a hell of a lot more than commonsense to be a good police officer!!!!!


I DID take the blue book test, and passed because I studied . you missed the topic, please check it out further, Commonsense is the most important part of a police officer NOT the only part of a police officer. It all starts with commonsense and that is why the enterence exam tests for that. I would hate to a a leo without it, how about you????? Look deeper into this topic and yuor will see a lengthy discussion I had about working for what you want.


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## j809

The police tests are a waste and measure nothing except ability to read and comprehend some information. However , police test are for entry level and require no prior experience. I think the exams should be revamped and minimum requirements to become a police officer should be raised to higher standards, standards that will make the job stand out as a professional job, no longer a blue collar worker. Non-CS PDs have different standards and I find that they have fewer problems then CS departments. I think the reason Non-CS PDs have fewer problems is because the hiring is very stringent, require experience, college degrees, military and can eliminate candidates for numerous things and not just a few things that CS Pds do.


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## testtaker

j809 said:


> The police tests are a waste and measure nothing except ability to read and comprehend some information. However , police test are for entry level and require no prior experience. I think the exams should be revamped and minimum requirements to become a police officer should be raised to higher standards, standards that will make the job stand out as a professional job, no longer a blue collar worker. Non-CS PDs have different standards and I find that they have fewer problems then CS departments. I think the reason Non-CS PDs have fewer problems is because the hiring is very stringent, require experience, college degrees, military and can eliminate candidates for numerous things and not just a few things that CS Pds do.


I stand corrected - I took the BROWN book exam to be hired - That said, I agree standard should be higher with a minimum of assoc degrees and Min of Bachelors for Sgt's. CS department can raise thier standards, however many chief, who refuse to pay money to recruit, find few people with degrees taking the tests. This is NOT a problem with the candidates, this is a problem with the departments. Many CS chiefs take the easy route which is just to pick form the list. You will find MUCH more corruption without the exam in place, believe me, just ask all the applicant already fighting with the chief nephew. At least we can say that the nephew must pass the test as well.


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## soup

I am new to this forum and this is my first post..................Testtaker.. I could not have said it better myself. I took three entry level civil service exams and improved on each one. I worked in the private sector as security for two major department stores and eventually became a lp manager. That was a good boost to the resume. I joined the auxiliary unit in my town and worked for free. I got to know all of the full timers and learned a lot from them. I finally got hired after nine years! I have been on for about six now and it is the best job I have ever had. As far as people who say civil service sucks: Once you are on in a civil service town, civil service is a great protection that we cannot afford to lose. No offense to the chiefs out there, but most of them are not civil service and they have very little protection if the town or city has them in a tight contract. It isn't that they can't hire good people because of civil service, it's that they can't (or have a much more difficult time) firing people because of civil service. As far as people bitching about "being white and in Massachusetts", when the horse is dead, get off. Stand in line like everyone else.


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## atrain104

misconceived said:


> Chief, can you tell me where in MA? I am a WHITE, male in my 20's, with 5 generations of law enforcement behind me. Despite high scores on the previous 2 exams I can't catch a break. Civil service needs to change.


tell me why you should catch a break, because your family is involved in the same profession you pursue? Thats Massachusetts for you. "I deserve , for my family has served"


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## misconceived

I am not saying that I should be hired because of my family background. I get a kick out of people saying "why aren't you on yet, can't they pull strings?" It does not work like that anymore, and I know this. As far as being white in Massachusetts, it is not a dead horse. Look at all the court cases in the past few years. I am white and I cannot get a job due to the fact that an individual that is not white gets moved to the top of the list...Minority my ass.The tests are commonsense. If you cannot get a high score you are a moron. Standing in line to get a job isn't easy when others get to cut the line for bullshit reasons, and I stand by my previous statement....CIVIL SERVICE IS BULLSHIT. Now that Deval patrick is in everyone will get hired :finger2: . Spend Spend Spend, just plan on paying higher taxes.:2c:


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## soup

Misconceived............ I can only assume that you are trying to get on a department within a city or town with a high minority population. I find it hard to imagine that the entire or even majority of the department that your trying to get on is made up of minorities. I'm not saying that it is right for minorities to be placed ahead of you if they scored lower. Did you ever imagine that they could have scored as high or perhaps better than you? What were your scores? Just because they get hired first doesn't mean it was because of racial preference within civil service. Civil service is not perfect, but as I always say, at least with civil service you know the rules before you apply and the rules are pretty clear most of the time. With a non civil service department you really need to kiss someones ass to get on or be related to someone. There are non civil service towns that every few years have to announce that a rule for being hired is that you cannot be related to anyone. I live in a town where the powers that be want to eliminate civil service for the chiefs and deputy chiefs positions. Because they want to hire from a state wide list. Civil service has answered every question i had and returned my phone calls within minutes of leaving messages. As far as Deval Patrick being governor, Mitt Romney gutted the civil service department over the past several years and there hasn't been much they could do because they had no resources. Did you see all of the layoffs over the past few years? That was due to cuts in local aid by Romney. Like it or not, taxes pay our salaries and put more police on the streets. Your in your twenties? My advice would be go to school and get your masters degree so that when you do get on you'll walk in the door at a pretty good base salary if your department has the Quinn bill.


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## j809

> With a non civil service department you really need to kiss someones ass to get on or be related to someone


Not true. You MUST have a FULL TIME academy to even make it to the interview process, period.


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## soup

j809 said:


> Not true. You MUST have a FULL TIME academy to even make it to the interview process, period.


In order to attend a full time academy in MA, Don't you need a town to "sponsor" you? The policy of the MCJTC is the student officer needs to be employed full time as a police officer isn't it? Previously members of my department were sent to the full time academy as reserve officers with no guarantee of a full time appointment once completed, in fact they worked as reserves for a couple of years before being hired full time. That practice is no more as far as I know. I attended the academy with members of a non civil service town and they were full time employees. Another was "sponsored" by a college department. How does one attend a full time academy otherwise? Hey, I could be wrong on this point about non civil service towns. I will stand corrected if I am.


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## chief801

soup said:


> In order to attend a full time academy in MA, Don't you need a town to "sponsor" you? The policy of the MCJTC is the student officer needs to be employed full time as a police officer isn't it? Previously members of my department were sent to the full time academy as reserve officers with no guarantee of a full time appointment once completed, in fact they worked as reserves for a couple of years before being hired full time. That practice is no more as far as I know. I attended the academy with members of a non civil service town and they were full time employees. Another was "sponsored" by a college department. How does one attend a full time academy otherwise? Hey, I could be wrong on this point about non civil service towns. I will stand corrected if I am.


You are correct. You now must be hired to attend the academy. In our situation, we look for a degree and an academy certification, which means, you either went to the academy before they changed the rules, or I'm stealing you from another department! We have a small department. I can't afford to run overtime shifts to fill a vacancy while we wait for someone to complete the academy. This also cuts down the amount of time new hires have to spend with an FTO. There is never a shortage of applicants whenever we advertise...it is not the place to apply if you are just breaking in. I feel for those of you trying to break in now. It is not easy. When I started, I had to go to the R/I academy. Work a minimum of two shifts a month for free, and attend all department training for free. The ones who got hired first were those of us that worked way more than the two required shifts, didn't bitch about foot patrol, never turned down any detail. Basically, had to prove you would be a good hire. Then they hired you and sent you to the academy. Far more involved than studying and taking a worthless test. You had to prove you wanted it AND do a good job.


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## testtaker

Chief, I'm starting to like you more and more..... :star: :star: :star: :star:


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## policelaborlaw.com

*Judge orders hiring of minority firefighters*

By Raja Mishra, Globe Staff | December 8, 2006
A federal judge yesterday ordered fire departments around the state to offer jobs to about 50 minority candidates who had been excluded from working as firefighters by a discriminatory hiring exam.

The ruling ends a 22-month legal struggle over hiring practices within the state's fire departments that was prompted by a discrimination lawsuit filed by four black men from Lynn.

In August, US District Court Judge Patti D. Saris ruled that the cognitive ability test administered to firefighting candidates around the state in 2002 and 2004 discriminated against minority applicants and violated federal civil rights law as well as a three-decade-old court order to integrate Massachusetts fire departments.
Saris found that the exam sought to evaluate skills that had little to do with fighting fires.

She ordered that fire departments offer jobs to minority candidates who applied in 2002 and 2004 and should have gotten jobs but for the cognitive exam. That would cover about 50 people, mostly in Boston, according to the Boston Society of Vulcans, which represents black and Hispanic firefighters and intervened with the NAACP on the plaintiffs' side.

Boston Fire Department officials did not comment.

The society's president, Karen Miller , said that an undetermined number of those 50 candidates had moved on to other jobs or out of the region but that many probably would take up the offer.

Although fire officials overhauled the exam before it was administered this past summer, lawyers in the case said they would scrutinize those results soon to make sure the test did not unfairly disqualify minorities.

"The 2006 exam is a big change from the previous exams, but we're still going to analyze the results," said Shannon Liss-Riordan , who represented the plaintiffs -- Jacob and Noah Bradley , Jared Thomas , and Keith Ridley.

"They are especially excited about this and looking forward to getting hired," said Liss-Riordan.

Jacob Bradley has been hired by the Lynn Fire Department.

Saris also ruled that each candidate is eligible for back pay.









Brian E. Simoneau
http://www.policelaborlaw.com


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## soxrock75

policelaborlaw.com said:


> In August, US District Court Judge Patti D. Saris ruled that the cognitive ability test administered to firefighting candidates around the state in 2002 and 2004 discriminated against minority applicants and violated federal civil rights law as well as a three-decade-old court order to integrate Massachusetts fire departments.
> Saris found that the exam sought to evaluate skills that had little to do with fighting fires.


:NO:


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## Enforcer174

With a ruling like that why even have a civil exam?


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## Buford T

To establish a list of non-minority, non-protected class individuals who can rot on the vine waiting for a job, civil circus at its finest.....


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