# Drivers licenses issued without SS#



## Irish Wampanoag (Apr 6, 2003)

Whats peoples thoughts on the House of Reps in ASSACHUSSETTS trying to pass HB2131, which would allow undocumented immigrants or what most people would say illegal immigrants (Basicly Felons) apply and be issued a driver license without a SS#.


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## Gil (Jun 15, 1998)

I sure wish they would find a better way to increase revenue :roll:


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## PATS246 (Jun 19, 2003)

I do agree that illegal immigrants shouldnt be able to get a license. But on the other hand from a law enforcement perspective I think this isn't such a bad idea. These people from other countries come here and have no problem getting a vehicle registered in this state. Then you stop them for a violation and they hand you a so called "international drivers license" that is worthless or a "drivers license" from their country which half the time I can't make head or tails of. At least if they were able to get a license in Mass, then we would be able to have more of a positive ID of who you are dealing with rather than passing off some excuse and a drivers license from de Brazill. This way they would have no excuse.


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## CenterMass (May 13, 2002)

Yeah, that sounds like a good idea..... :FT: 

So, when Jose Lopez leaves the country because he's wanted for a murder, he'll be able to return a few months later with someone else's identification, obtain a new Mass license and never get questioned when he gets stopped for a mv violation.

Or.... not issue immigrants a license, lock them up for 90-10 when they're driving and then print them and find out if they are wanted under a different name. And even if they aren't, now you at least have their prints (of their current ID) on record.

It's easy enough for these people to have multiple aliases, why make it even easier? Oh yeah....


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## Guest (Oct 29, 2003)

This country is getting soft, these politicians are loosing there minds. 

Whats the difference when they come to this country we give them $ to live along every other benny anyway (meanwhile they live 30 deep in one apartment). This system is ass backwards.

:!: I have an idea what they should do is when you come across an illegal immigrant is legistlature should pass a law that allows LE to drive the dirty sanchez to logan make him sit in a detention center for 90 - 100 days (while we print/ DNA him/her) then after the the 100 days are up FED-EX his him/hers sorry ass back home (overnight express prefered) , NO Questions asked. And if you come across one who committed a crime he/she gets NO BAIL ( after all there illegal and shouldnt be afforded all the due process rights)and after his/her trial if he/she is guilty he/she goes to jail and after his/her sentence is completed he/she is shipped back to the desert,jungle or wherever he/she came from (drop ship'em, slap a parachute on there back and do a fly over there prepective country and say austulavista baby- dont worry they'll find there way home), if he/she is innocent they still spend there 100 days in the pokey he/she gets shipped out in the same fashion.

This counrty needs to send a clear message, and giving them driver license's totaly sends the wrong message. :BM: 

Just my :2c: on how to send a message to illegal immigrants coming to this country.


Thats it I'm moving to MEXICO. Maybe I can join the Federalies, I certainly cant seem to get any fulltime work here.Maybe there civil service process is easier, Hmmmmm I wonder, then again maybe I'll bring mucho denero and buy me a nice ranking offical job within the police force. :L:


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## Crvtte65 (May 19, 2002)

I was at home the other day looking at the paper and the front page headline was something like Life in Fear. Go on reading it, it's about an illegal immigrant who works three jobs and is in fear from being deported. I'm looking at it going ookkk, why are they turning it into a sob story?


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## PearlOnyx (Jun 28, 2002)

This is the most rediculous thing I have ever heard. These people are here illegally, and our government is going to give them state issued ID. So as I see it, if this passes, and the RMV doesn't report every illegal that's given a license to the INS, then they are covering up crimes. This bill basically condones the state government concealing a federal crime. Rediculous, write your local congressmman!


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## Guest (Oct 29, 2003)

PearlOnyx said:


> This is the most rediculous thing I have ever heard. These people are here illegally, and our government is going to give them state issued ID. So as I see it, if this passes, and the RMV doesn't report every illegal that's given a license to the INS, then they are covering up crimes. This bill basically condones the state government concealing a federal crime. Rediculous, write your local congressmman!


I hea ya, however to add to that, dont just write your Goverment, ring there phone off the wall (<--- unfortunately most of us dont have the time for), but I think thats part of the problem Squeaky wheel gets the grease, right? Those the bleeding heart liberals who are constantly bitching and complaining get the most attention, while most just sit back and "WOW :shock: thats really F*@cked up". Well #-o if you dont speak up these are the kind of things were going to have to live with, (illegal immigrants with drivers licenses). Whats next? Legislature will force every American to have to give up a room in our homes to house any illegal immigrant until he gets his papers and can walk on his own? :BM:


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## tomahawk (May 1, 2002)

I do not get it... why are these reps pushing for laws like this, when the people they are benefitting do not have the power to vote?! This one does not make any sense... ](*,) 

-Mike :BM:


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## Irish Wampanoag (Apr 6, 2003)

I hea ya, however to add to that, dont just write your Goverment, ring there phone off the wall (<--- unfortunately most of us dont have the time for), but I think thats part of the problem Squeaky wheel gets the grease, right? Those the bleeding heart liberals who are constantly bitching and complaining get the most attention, while most just sit back and "WOW :shock: thats really F*@cked up". Well #-o if you dont speak up these are the kind of things were going to have to live with, (illegal immigrants with drivers licenses). Whats next? Legislature will force every American to have to give up a room in our homes to house any illegal immigrant until he gets his papers and can walk on his own? :BM:[/quote]

Thats Right Hunter!!! When I came into work the other day my Chief told me about the story which I had read in the paper the night before. I immediately got on the bat phone and called my state Rep's office and told her office if she votes for this House Bill HB2131 she will not get a vote from my house in her the next election. 
The rep sponsering the bill represents Framingham/Ashland area but I forgot her name. I am wondering what her motive is? Also rep O'Flarity from Chelsea is endorsing the bill GEEE I wonder what his motive is???? Note also Mass Chief's Association is endorsing the bill as well HUMMMM?

GPD11 you do make a valid point!


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## EFG (Sep 24, 2003)

Let them drive, the state gets $$$, and they have to pass the test. Also they probably will need some offical documentation as to who they are, that will make it harder for them to have multiple names,DOB,ect.....


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## Killjoy (Jun 23, 2003)

One more point, all the Registry cares about is making money. I can't remember the exact words of The Registrar but it was something to the effect of "The primary job of the registry is to generate money for the commowealth." This is why the registry refuses to invest more money in making the registry computer system more accessible and modern. We have to be the only state in where the registry goes down almost every night. OFF TOPIC : Also clerks at the RMV are under specific orders NOT to tell Troopers working down at the Registry if the people they're helping have active warrants (it shows up on their computer too, if the person has a license or ID). We could scoop up a couple of dozen people a day at busy Registry offices if they told us. When asked why he ordered the clerks not to tell police about warrants his response was: "We are not a law enforcement agency." How's that for cooperation?


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## Guest (Oct 30, 2003)

EFG said:


> Let them drive, the state gets $$$, and they have to pass the test. Also they probably will need some offical documentation as to who they are, that will make it harder for them to have multiple names,DOB,ect.....


Are you nuts, let them drive? it gives the state $ what ever happend to doing the right thing, There ILLEGAL ALIENS for christ sake. And in my opinion shouldnt be afforded or more importantly REWARDED for being in this country ilegally. We have a process for them to go through, LET them go through it. To hell with this rewarding them for being here illegally thats BS.

Killjoy275,

One more point, all the Registry cares about is making money. I can't remember the exact words of The Registrar but it was something to the effect of "The primary job of the registry is to generate money for the commowealth." This is why the registry refuses to invest more money in making the registry computer system more accessible and modern. We have to be the only state in where the registry goes down almost every night. OFF TOPIC : Also clerks at the RMV are under specific orders NOT to tell Troopers working down at the Registry if the people they're helping have active warrants (it shows up on their computer too, if the person has a license or ID). We could scoop up a couple of dozen people a day at busy Registry offices if they told us. When asked why he ordered the clerks not to tell police about warrants his response was: "We are not a law enforcement agency." How's that for cooperation?

That has to be the most ridiculous thing I ever heard, I cant believe that. So what the hell do they have Troopers in the RMV for? To give security for the employees? so when someone reaches over the counter to knock one of them out for there shitass attiudes they can be saved by the Trooper. The same should go for people who have warrants the Troopers should be told and that person should be taken in "END OF STORY".

Incidently is that in writing anywhere, like a memo sent to the RMV employees. If so someone should step up to the plate and fax a copy to the news papers and see how the registrar likes them apples. I'm still shaken my head what is wrong with these people? And people wonder why things never get better. :BM: It ass backwards shit like that, and then people point to the police for not doing a better job of slowing crime, well hey if theres no cooperation between state agencies and the Troopers arent allowed to do there job without there hands tied then WTF theres your answer.

Sorry for the banter but that piss's me off. :BM: :BM:


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## Southside (Sep 4, 2003)

Hunter,

It should piss you off! It is good to see you speak your mind, shows your passion. Unfortunately nothing will be done until something bad happens and then they will do they typical and blame law enforcement.


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## Guest (Oct 31, 2003)

Shawnr76,

Sad to say you are correct, the politicains wont listen until more shit happens, and I think it is suffuce to that your right LE is going to be the whipping board. But all the politicains do (in my opinon) is go in circles. And I believe MT1 said it best in his answer to your question about community policing.


MT1's comment:

Community policing, world peace, balanced ethnic diversity, renewable fuel resources...all neat ideas but the goal is harder to reach when you're carrying reality on your back.

The reality of this is nothing will change unless something happens and thats is not the way it should be.


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## Gil (Jun 15, 1998)

> And in my opinion shouldn't be afforded or more importantly REWARDED for being in this country ilegally.


Yes but call INS and see what type of response you get.... "Um give a call when you have like 50 or so rounded up, then we might come by"

It seems the only way INS takes a look at smaller groups or individuals is when they get a lengthy bop and have been in the system for a while.


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## EFG (Sep 24, 2003)

Guess what Hunter, they are going to drive anyway. What I was saying is lets make the best out of a bad situation. Why not make $$ that the state badly needs, and at least give these people some education as to what the rules of the road are. Then when they do cause a problem when driving, LE can say that it was the registry that gave them their license.


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## Guest (Nov 4, 2003)

EFG said:


> Guess what Hunter, they are going to drive anyway. What I was saying is lets make the best out of a bad situation. Why not make $$ that the state badly needs, and at least give these people some education as to what the rules of the road are. Then when they do cause a problem when driving, LE can say that it was the registry that gave them their license.


Why even play the blame game, and as far as the making $, like any of us will ever see where it goes and benifit by it, I tend to think not.I understand what your saying but IMHO I dont think it something that should be entertained, illegal is illegal, and if they want to drive and be afforded privlages then become a citizen. I think the engergy should be placed on enforcing the illegal aliens instead of pampering it.

Why dont we legalize marajuana while were at it and we can tax itand make $ off of it.

Sorry but I disagree. I dont think illegal aliens should be allowed to have drivers licenes's I think it sends the wrong message in alot of different areas.


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## ryan933 (Oct 3, 2003)

IMHO..there are 3 ways to deal with this.

1) Every time we catch an illegal, they are summarily deported. However, that will never happen because supposedly illegals comprise nearly the entire bottom layer of the economy. If we were to get rid of them in short order, the country would grind to a halt. I don't know that this is entirely true, but I suspect it is not all that far fetched.  

2) Give the illegals a drivers license. No. Just a plain bad idea. The day we start rewarding people, illegal or otherwise, for breaking the law we begin a downhill slide that will likely be unrecoverable. I realize some states like CA already reward illegals for breaking our immigration laws by giving them health care etc. BAD BAD NEWS! :BM: 

3) Create a new status for these illegals and those who wish to come here for extended, yet not necessarily permanent stays. Call it a "Work Visa" that must be renewed every year. Incorporated in this "Work Visa" would be a tax id number so we can make certain these people pay taxes on the money they earn here. That is the biggest problem, illegals are a drain on the system because they don't pay taxes etc. and to exacerbate the situation they don't even spend much of the money they make, which would at least put it back into the economy. Instead they send it home to their families outside the US, so our economy loses twice over! The US government could set a date for all illegals in the country to come forward and get signed up for a "Work Visa" by a certain date, and anyone caught after that date would be deported immediately. Then they would have to renew this "Work Visa" every year, for a fee of course, and would also have a background check done as a prerequisite to renewal. If they got in any trouble during the previous year, SEE YA! [-X 

I like number 3, however I think the "Work Visa" concept already exists, just not the way I would like it to work. :roll: 

Ryan


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## ryan933 (Oct 3, 2003)

Let me also say that some of the people I referred to in my previous post as "illegals" are actually very good people. I feel my argument still stands, but it is not to say that they are all bad. Many are good hard working people and deserve to stay here more than some natural born US citizens! I think they should be given a fair chance as long as they are paying taxes, obeying the law(despite having entered the country illegally, perhaps for which there should be a fine?), and learning to speak English.

Oh well, I guess I have not solved the counties problems in the last 30 minutes, but I tried.  

Ryan


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## PearlOnyx (Jun 28, 2002)

Alot of the arguments I hear for this idea are:

"It'll make us money!"

My response: So will a million other illegal things. With this train of thought, let's grow pot on the medians, because that will make us money too.

"They are going to drive anyways, so we mind as well document them, give them a license, and let them get insurance".

My response: "They are going to smoke crack anyways, so we mind as well make it legal, and give them free healthcare when the OD". This mindset seems to be of the "Oh well, I give up" sort. It may sound kind of idealistic, but we are here to defend the law, not give up on it.

Goverment sanctioning the actions of illegal immigrints is outright wrong in my opinion.


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## EFG (Sep 24, 2003)

I must have missed this: 
HUNTER SAYS: "I have an idea what they should do is when you come across an illegal immigrant is legistlature should pass a law that allows LE to drive the dirty sanchez to logan make him sit in a detention center for 90 - 100 days (while we print/ DNA him/her) then after the the 100 days are up FED-EX his him/hers sorry ass back home (overnight express prefered)"
You are right sir, what we can do is "concentrate" these people into "camps". A similar thing was done in Europe in the 30's, I don't remember how that ended up. 
Also it is nice to see so many Native Americas that are interested in this topic, What tribe are you people with? Lets not forget our roots, this is America, a melting pot.


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## mpd61 (Aug 7, 2002)

EFG said:


> I must have missed this:
> HUNTER SAYS: "I have an idea what they should do is when you come across an illegal immigrant is legistlature should pass a law that allows LE to drive the dirty sanchez to logan make him sit in a detention center for 90 - 100 days (while we print/ DNA him/her) then after the the 100 days are up FED-EX his him/hers sorry ass back home (overnight express prefered)"
> You are right sir, what we can do is "concentrate" these people into "camps". A similar thing was done in Europe in the 30's, I don't remember how that ended up.
> Also it is nice to see so many Native Americas that are interested in this topic, What tribe are you people with? Lets not forget our roots, this is America, a melting pot.


You might have missed the part where hunter suggested the "final solution" as sending them back to their country of origin.
:roll: 
To even suggest a comparison to "concentration camps" is quite a stretch!
Deportation is a far cry from extermination. YEESH! lighten up!
:shock:


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## Guest (Nov 6, 2003)

Efg,

Your profile states your interests are drinking,smoking and all kinds of sh$t, and that implies what???? Nevermind maybe you where indulging in your interest of smoking (gods knows what :shock: ) when you posted your last post and attempted to to imlpy I'm drawing a paralell between concentration camps to deporting illegal immigrants. And If you equate concentration camps and a deportation holding facility as one in the same, you need to find something different to smoke because its really depleting you brain cells.

Instead of using a quote from a fictional Hollywood cop movie, your qoute should say something more to the effect of:

This is drugs (&lt;--insert picture of a crack pipe).
This is your brain on drugs (&lt;---insert picture of yourself,efg)


READ before you reply.


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## PearlOnyx (Jun 28, 2002)

We have this discussion at work all the time, and I always get a similar flawed logic statement similar to EFG's. "Remember where you came from! What about your family? etc." The biggest problem here is that my family floated over on the big boat from Ireland and went through immigration and came here legally, and quickly applied and gained citizenship. They learned english and established a legitimate business and made a life here. Huge difference from some of the illegals who are here, well...illegally.


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## jd (Oct 18, 2002)

In my opinion, the biggest problem with this is not giving an illegal immigrant the privilege of driving. The issue is that you are giving them a government issued ID based on what? They are not going have any paperwork to prove their identity (passport, visa, birth certificate, etc.). It’s going to make it too easy to get a legitimate ID with a false identity.


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## EFG (Sep 24, 2003)

My opinion stays the same, and a helpfull tip for everyone. Don't leave a computer unattended in a public area, people have been know to change or add funny things to a profile.


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