# Mass Needs to Expunge records not just seal them



## EightEightteen (Mar 10, 2008)

In Mass if you get arrested for a crime that you did not commit, your arrest record cannot be cleared because the state only seals records and doesn't expunge them. During a background check police departments will see that you have a sealed record on file and assume you just got off on a technicality. The DA says that he wants to retain this information just incase you are in a gang and they want to find known associates by your arrest information. Anyone else think that these records should be tossed out?


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## Gil (Jun 15, 1998)

You come to a pro police site and ask this?



> During a background check police departments will see that you have a sealed record on file and assume you just got off on a technicality.


Because that's what usually happens.



> Anyone else think that these records should be tossed out?


No


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## justanotherparatrooper (Aug 27, 2006)

let me get my popcorn and beer......this is gonna be fun. 

int:


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## j809 (Jul 5, 2002)

I think there should be something where it can tossed completely. A Massasoit PD sergeant was wrongly charged and arraigned for something that another larger state agency screwed up on. Once it is at arraignment it is on the BOP, forever. The case was immediately tossed and charges were dismissed. Yet he has a BOP now which cannot be expunged. He shouldn't have to explain himself when he applies for a job, an LTC or gets stopped for a MV violation and officer sees a gun charge on his BOP. Yes the system in MA sucks and needs to be addressed.


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## 94c (Oct 21, 2005)

EightEightteen said:


> In Mass if you get arrested for a crime that you did not commit, your arrest record cannot be cleared because the state only seals records and doesn't expunge them. During a background check police departments will see that you have a sealed record on file and assume you just got off on a technicality. The DA says that he wants to retain this information just incase you are in a gang and they want to find known associates by your arrest information. Anyone else think that these records should be tossed out?


First off, I'm gonna go mix my meds with Scotch.

Be right back...



j809 said:


> I think there should be something where it can tossed completely. A Massasoit PD sergeant was wrongly charged and arraigned for something that another larger state agency screwed up on. Once it is at arraignment it is on the BOP, forever. The case was immediately tossed and charges were dismissed. Yet he has a BOP now which cannot be expunged. He shouldn't have to explain himself when he applies for a job, an LTC or gets stopped for a MV violation and officer sees a gun charge on his BOP. Yes the system in MA sucks and needs to be addressed.


Chapter 6: Section 175. Inspection of record information by individual concerned; corrections; procedure; restrictions

Section 175. Each individual shall have the right to inspect, and if practicable, copy, criminal offender record information which refers to him. If an individual believes such information to be inaccurate or incomplete, he shall request the agency having custody or control of the records to purge, modify or supplement them. If the agency declines to so act, or if the individual believes the agency's decision to be otherwise unsatisfactory, the individual may in writing request review by the board. The board shall in each case in which it finds prima facie basis for complaint, conduct a hearing at which the individual may appear with counsel, present evidence, and examine and cross-examine witnesses. Written findings shall be issued within sixty days of receipt by the board of the request for review. Failure to issue findings shall be deemed a decision of the board. *If the record in question is found to be inaccurate, incomplete or misleading, the board shall order that the record be appropriately purged, modified, or supplemented by explanatory notation.*


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## j809 (Jul 5, 2002)

Yes but he and his attorney already called CHSB and courts, it can NEVER be expunged completely.


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## justanotherparatrooper (Aug 27, 2006)

j809 said:


> Yes but he and his attorney already called CHSB and courts, it can NEVER be expunged completely.


*There is ALWAYs going to be a record of arrest, may not be "fair" but thats life. He will just have to explain it to the BI....*


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## Gil (Jun 15, 1998)

Q5-TPR said:


> I know it is in violation of Gen Order #1, but para, please pass me a cold one!


Ah shit I can't drink when I come to visit?


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## justanotherparatrooper (Aug 27, 2006)

:t:


Q5-TPR said:


> I know it is in violation of Gen Order #1, but para, please pass me a cold one!


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## Guest (Mar 11, 2008)

Has it been a full moon the last couple of days?


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## USMCTrooper (Oct 23, 2003)

I'm not a fan of expunging a record esp since most of us here know the arrest is valid, however, 6 years ago I was told a story by a Superior Court prosecutor about a guy who was clearly, plain and simple, wrongly charged with murder. The "witness" who ID'd him was actually one of the accomplices to the killing. The brilliant detectives found the "witnesses" bag near the scene. He said he was a witness and they believed it. The guy wrongly accused wouldnt give an alibi because at the time of the killing, he was a passenger in a vehicle involved in a hit and run in another city but was afraid if he told the truth his uncle, the driver, would get in trouble. He was indicted and arraigned and headed for trial before the truth came out. It was an embarrassment for the DA's office and ultimately confirmed by the PD investigating the crash. His record still shows the charge, 6 years later. Shame on him for lying but WTF..........like I said I'm no liberal but in this case thats just plain F*CKED UP


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## Tuna (Jun 1, 2006)

j809 said:


> I think there should be something where it can tossed completely. A Massasoit PD sergeant was wrongly charged and arraigned for something that another larger state agency screwed up on. Once it is at arraignment it is on the BOP, forever. The case was immediately tossed and charges were dismissed. Yet he has a BOP now which cannot be expunged. He shouldn't have to explain himself when he applies for a job, an LTC or gets stopped for a MV violation and officer sees a gun charge on his BOP. Yes the system in MA sucks and needs to be addressed.


What's the issue with explaining it, if it was a mistake so be it. A large amount of arrests come from having "heads up" on the nitwit your dealing with. The BOP is a great tool to have at your disposal


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## EightEightteen (Mar 10, 2008)

Gil said:


> You come to a pro police site and ask this?
> 
> Because that's what usually happens.
> 
> No


Your response is a typical one, i would most likely respond the same way. But if you are in law enforcement, you know for a fact that sometimes innocent people are arrested, there are mistakes or false accusations. It may be uncommon, but it happens. Why should someone else have to suffer because of a mistake or because someone had a grudge against them?


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## EightEightteen (Mar 10, 2008)

mtc said:


> I think you're lost hunny - if you were arrested, it's because you committed a crime.
> 
> Cambridge is that way...... no..... that way.... really!


Not exactly sweetcheeks. My little brother is just starting apply to some departments and thats exactly the problem that he is facing. Now I know my opinion is biased as im related to him, but you have to admit that there are situations were people are arrested and are innocent. Maybe you're familiar with "Innocent until proven guilty"? Ive seen far to many applicants blackballed because of dismissals and in certain cases there should be a way to prevent that from happening.



USMCTrooper said:


> I'm not a fan of expunging a record esp since most of us here know the arrest is valid.....
> 
> .....however, 6 years ago I was told a story by a Superior Court prosecutor about a guy who was clearly, plain and simple, wrongly charged with murder.


It looks like your first statement contradicts your second one. I dont know how we would know that every arrest made is valid.


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## BartA1 (May 5, 2002)

818,

if it was a mistake and your brother is truthful about what happened and everything else on his background is squeaky clean it shouldnt hold him back. Unless he was charged wth some despicable crime.


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## Crvtte65 (May 19, 2002)

Gil said:


> Because that's what usually happens.


hahah i thought the same exact thing. Kinda like when people come and complain about the tickets... "you know that sometimes the cop gets it wrong, it was the other car".... noooo sorry I am not aware of that problem :mrgreen:


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## EightEightteen (Mar 10, 2008)

Crvtte65 said:


> hahah i thought the same exact thing. Kinda like when people come and complain about the tickets... "you know that sometimes the cop gets it wrong, it was the other car".... noooo sorry I am not aware of that problem :mrgreen:


The problem is that he said that's "usually" the case, meaning not always. It's just too bad that there's not a way to fix and obviously innocents persons record. Ive sat on too many oral boards to not know how a dismissal on a record is always a negative, regardless of the excuse.



mikemac64 said:


> There are cops, and we all know some, who have BOP's. If you got a disorderly down the cape when you were 17, or minor in possession, or something like that, you probably won't have a problem in most situations. It all depends on what the reports say. And even the most half assed BI will get those reports.
> 
> It depends not only on the crime, but the circumstances surrounding the crime, and also the disposition.
> 
> Now, if someone is exonerated, not a NG, but exonerated, I might not have an issue removing it. I apply this to someone who was truly framed/mis ID'd/etc (anyone remember Kenny Connoly)? But I think those cases are truly few and far between, especially since a NG does not necessarily mean innocent.


I know that it shouldn't be a big deal in the long run, but for some people it could be the straw that broke the camels back. The problem with NG not necessarily meaning innocent is that our system is based on being innocent until proven guilty. Now I know that most of the time a valid arrest means that the person is guilty, but to not allow any expungements just leaves the few innocent people twisting in the wind.


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## EightEightteen (Mar 10, 2008)

mikemac64 said:


> Kid, you got some love from some of us here. I am a cop in a medium sized city, and there was a Trooper who gave you some too as well as some others.
> 
> Put it all out there and let us see what a model citizen your brother is. What was he charged with? What was the disposition? What else is on his record? Were there victims? Otherwise this is an abstract academic conversation.


I started out in NH for few years and have been on a decent sized Mass force for almost 9, so im familiar with how the system works. That being said I was more interested in hearing peoples' thoughts on the issue. Ive noticed a lot of "the cop is always right" attitude in a couple posts and I understand that. I was just wondering if anyone saw it from the otherside.


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## EightEightteen (Mar 10, 2008)

mtc said:


> "
> 
> Fess up pup! What'd your brother do? For real, like his whole in-court career?


His ex is a little off-balanced to say the least and had him arrested for domestic. The charges were dropped at arraignment. Maybe I'm wrong and he really did smack her around, but I doubt it.


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## j809 (Jul 5, 2002)

Tuna said:


> What's the issue with explaining it, if it was a mistake so be it. A large amount of arrests come from having "heads up" on the nitwit your dealing with. The BOP is a great tool to have at your disposal


He should NOT have to explain himself as he is innocent and the MSP LT F*CKED UP SO BAD that they even admitted, they found the missing gun on a night shift officer which no one bothered to do an inventory on, yet this poor sgt was charged with larceny of a firearm. After arraignment it's there forever, even though it's dismissed and even got a 'sorry,we fucked up letter". Why should he explain himself? How would you like to explain yourself to an officer during a stop that the murder charge on your BOP is bogus. Yeah, I would tell you to go pound sand too. They system is scrwed up and it does need some changes for these type of cases.


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## sgtsmithers (Oct 3, 2005)

EightEightteen said:


> His ex is a little off-balanced to say the least and had him arrested for domestic. The charges were dropped at arraignment. Maybe I'm wrong and he really did smack her around, but I doubt it.


I'll guess the charges were dropped because the victim didn't show up or wouldn't testify. "not guilty" doesn't always mean "innocent". Was bro arrested because the responding officer found bruises and a boot print on her cheek? etc.


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## 94c (Oct 21, 2005)

EightEightteen said:


> Ive sat on too many oral boards to not know how a dismissal on a record is always a negative, regardless of the excuse.


I call Bullshit....

You want a record to be expunged because a person is innocent but yet you see that same record as a negative?

That police report is going to surface no matter what the BOP says. He'll still have to explain it BOP or NOT.

Someone like you who has sat on too many oral boards would be expected to know that. No?


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