# Civil Service Test



## Crvtte65 (May 19, 2002)

Good luck to everyone taking the exam tomorrow


----------



## Guest (Apr 26, 2003)

Did anyone else feel that the civil service test seemed to be much harder then 2 years ago.


----------



## Crvtte65 (May 19, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*

I was getting really annoyed with the "put these sentences in order" :|


----------



## PearlOnyx (Jun 28, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*

I'm just glad that I did better with the memory portion. Last time, I got a 96, and I can guarantee you that every question that I blew was in that section, because I screwed up the names of the stores. This time around, I had every one memorized and down pat. So that's all good..I'm hoping for a 98 this time around.

I did notice that there was a few questions that were harder than the last one, including a few that were even questionable, but not too bad overall. Kinda pissed I had to drive all the way to Haverhill this time around though.


----------



## Officer Dunngeon (Aug 16, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*

Every civil service exam I have taken, I have gone up two points... last time I got a 97. This time, I really don't know. It was a lot more difficult because I think the rocket scientists who designed it are getting more and more thick. Anybody notice the question where the answer should have been must inform of the right to self-incrimination rather than what was printed as self-DISCRIMINATION?

There were a few other ones, like the one that said a police officer may not arrest for A. a misdemeanor in the presence, regardless of statute or D. an arrest warrant which must clearly be presented (or however it was worded)... what was up with that one?

I think the highlight of the exam was when the proctor for the room I was in wrote the address for Ashburton Place on the chalk board... all correspondence must be addressed to "Human RECOURSES." :evil:


----------



## Crvtte65 (May 19, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*



Nighthag said:


> There were a few other ones, like the one that said a police officer may not arrest for A. a misdemeanor in the presence, regardless of statute or D. an arrest warrant which must clearly be presented (or however it was worded... what was up with that one?


Yea I was confused with that one.

I have a question to those who have taken it before. One was about pursing someone into another jurisdiction and the officer arrested the person. There were 3 reasons why he was incorrect only and one made sense, because speeding/red light isn't arrestable. Then there was one that was he was correct and I chose that one because the question states "based on the info above" and there isn't anything mentioned on what is arrestable so would I be correct?


----------



## Officer Dunngeon (Aug 16, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*

I chose he was correct in arresting him, not for failure to stop at a red light and speeding, but for failure to stop for a police officer.

I think all the other choices were incorrect, right? I don't remember, BRAIN OVERLOAD FROM TOO MUCH STUPIDITY!!!!


----------



## Crvtte65 (May 19, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*


----------



## tomahawk (May 1, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*

Ok thanks Dungie, glad I was not the only one scratching my head on the self-discrimination nonsense. Go HRD (or however they spell it...)

I also debated the red light/pursuit arrest. Since it said 'Based on the information above', I figured throw all outside knowledge out the window, and he's cuffed because he did something naughty in front of the officer. A non-LE taking the test is not expected to know the statute regarding red lights or failure to obey or whatever.

Now we all get to play the waiting game for 6 months waiting for the scores to come back!

-Mike, still soaked from waiting in line outside for 45 minutes trying to get in this morning


----------



## sully161 (May 2, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*

I did catch the "self-discrimination" answer. I'll presume a typo by HRD. On the one with the pursuit, HRD didn't provide enough information to answer the question. Yes, most know about failing to stop, but HRD should have listed what was arrestable and what wasn't. At least these two questions will be appealed and all should be given credit for them.


----------



## Vino5SJ (Dec 25, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*



Officer Dunngeon said:


> I chose he was correct in arresting him, not for failure to stop at a red light and speeding, but for failure to stop for a police officer.


But it didnt say anywhere in there that failure to stop for a PO is arrestable. So i put incorrect because there was not enough info that showed the person purposely evaded him, because they later pulled over. This test is supposed to be for people with no LE experience so i said incorrect on lack of information. :?


----------



## LeadDog17 (May 3, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*



Officer Dunngeon said:


> Every civil service exam I have taken, I have gone up two points... last time I got a 97. This time, I really don't know. It was a lot more difficult because I think the rocket scientists who designed it are getting more and more thick. Anybody notice the question where the answer should have been must inform of the right to self-incrimination rather than what was printed as self-DISCRIMINATION?
> 
> There were a few other ones, like the one that said a police officer may not arrest for A. a misdemeanor in the presence, regardless of statute or D. an arrest warrant which must clearly be presented (or however it was worded)... what was up with that one?
> 
> I think the highlight of the exam was when the proctor for the room I was in wrote the address for Ashburton Place on the chalk board... all correspondence must be addressed to "Human RECOURSES." :evil:


Errrrr :evil: :evil: :evil: 
I was thoroughly annoyed - I think I spotted a spelling/grammar error or a typo on almost every other page! This was my first HRD specific exam (as in not written by another agency, like MSP or MEP) and I thought it was a JOKE! Poorly written, poorly formated, and poorly published. I don't think it was ever even edited. It felt almost like the writer had no writing experience whatsoever. I am used to professionally published exams by testing agencies (Like the College Board, ACT, GMAT, LSAT, GRE, MBTI, and the like). HRD would be wise to contract the testing out to a firm that specializes in the field. It would cost less and they would get a better test that would yield more accurate results. As it is, I'm not sure exactly what the test is a measurement of - I understand what it is supposed to to, but I don't think it accomplishes its goal.

Also - I understand it is difficult, but, LOCATION IS KEY! Why have the test at middle schools with small desks and limited parking! They would do well to at least find proctors who could READ (mine couldn't read the instructions)

I think HRD definitely qualifies for today's DOPE SLAP!

Bitching aside, I didn't find the exam terribly difficult. I just sort of chuckled my way through it. We'll see how it goes!

-Eric


----------



## sully161 (May 2, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*

There was not a enough information to answer the question at all. It is for the lay person, so they need to tell us what is arrestable and what isn't. Correct, we don't know if failing to stop for a po is arrestable, nor do we know or told what the consquence for a speeding violation is either. So, they leave you with not enough to answer the question.a


----------



## LeadDog17 (May 3, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*



sully161 said:


> There was not a enough information to answer the question at all. It is for the lay person, so they need to tell us what is arrestable and what isn't. Correct, we don't know if failing to stop for a po is arrestable, nor do we know or told what the consquence for a speeding violation is either. So, they leave you with not enough to answer the question.a


This is one case in point for why outsourcing the creation of the test is the way to go! These companies DON'T make stupid mistakes like that - if they do, they don't get PAID!


----------



## union1 (Sep 18, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*

I also saw MANY questions that did not give enough information to make even a correct assumption. I did spend 20 minutes on the DISCRIMINATION one thinking there was something I missed. Overall tho the test was a bit harder this time around.

I plan on writing a letter about #69 to HRD. That was bullshit. Does anyone know if you can get a copy of the test incase you wanted to appeal a question you dont remmeber the number or correct wording for?


----------



## Crvtte65 (May 19, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*

I don't think you can get a copy but go through the appeals process. I would guess that's how you complain even if you aren't sure what you are appealing


----------



## Officer Dunngeon (Aug 16, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*



Vino5SJ said:


> But it didnt say anywhere in there that failure to stop for a PO is arrestable. So i put incorrect because there was not enough info that showed the person purposely evaded him, because they later pulled over. This test is supposed to be for people with no LE experience so i said incorrect on lack of information. :?


Right, but you also have to keep in mind that you can't read too much into these questions, as people sometimes tend to do. The designers obviously need to go back to 3rd grade and proof-read their sloppy work before turning it in. I understand that the information of what is and isn't arrestable was not provided in the paragraph, but the other answers were more wrong than the wrong answer... at least I hope it was! Besides, as a citizen, you should know what your rights are and aren't in the Commonwealth. Before I was even involved in LE, I knew that I could not be arrested for speeding or running a red light, but I also knew I'd be in the shit if I didn't stop when a cop tried to pull me over!

Yes, the test was obviously written carelessly, and a it is a psychologist's dream to sit around and analyze all day what each and every question is SUPPOSED to mean, but unfortunately you have to pick the simplest answer, hard as it is do to. I think it's a common idea that the test is meant for a civilian who is not already involved in law enforcement, but I disagree with that. I think they do want people with some ideas or some experience to get their foot in the door and weed out all the rest until they have a better grasp on things.

From a political point of view, a lot of people who take these exams are the sons and daughters of police officers who have or are obtaining a degree in CJ, cadets, specials, reserves, part timers, etc. They want to get these people in. That's why I think in the minds of the creators of the exam, this is the so called "easy stuff" that their already knowledgeable kids, nephews, nieces, etc. would be able to answer.

Or maybe I'm just analyzing too much... :?: :?


----------



## j809 (Jul 5, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*

I put the officer was incorrect. You cannot make an arrest for speeding and red light. The guy accelrated and then pulled the MV over. Not enough for failure to stop. Also the self-discrimination was not a typo, it was a tricky question. I spent about 20 minutes on it, it was the other answer about disclosing all informartion about the investigation, you can disclose some informartion about what you are investigating. There were about ten questions that were tricky and you had to look really careful. Good luck


----------



## Officer Dunngeon (Aug 16, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*

I recall the question asking what do you HAVE to disclose. The paragraph said you did not have to disclose what you are interrogating them about or their status (and I forget the other one).

Oh well, it's not like anyone's gonna be hired off this test anyway!


----------



## j809 (Jul 5, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*

Yep, I'm going to CareerWorks in July, if the layoffs go through.


----------



## ROBOCOP1982 (Sep 4, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*

Was it me or were there WAY too many sentence ordering questions. :roll: 
The questions about the red light was tricky, but I put that he was correct in making the arrest. The question said that the "pursuit ensued into another town" and the information before the question talked about how officers can make an arrest outside of thier jurisdiction if the offense was committed in front of them and led into another town.  Right?


----------



## Irishpride (May 5, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*



Officer Dunngeon said:


> Oh well, it's not like anyone's gonna be hired off this test anyway!


Come on now you know better than that. It just depends on where you live .

As far as people overanalyzing questions, IMHO that's usually a sure fire way to get questions wrong. Of course there are trick questions but they have to do with grammar and attention to detail. Usually when someone is taking the CS exam and reading between the lines to the point where basic common sense is not being used they're off the mark.

On a side note can someone tell me why with all the technology the state has to its disposal why are they still using those awful drawings that look like they were drawn by a kid in Jr. High?


----------



## Crvtte65 (May 19, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*



Officer Dunngeon said:


> Oh well, it's not like anyone's gonna be hired off this test anyway!


Noooo! My hopes and dreams are crushed! :wink:


----------



## ROBOCOP1982 (Sep 4, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*

How long does it usually take to get the results back? :?:


----------



## Officer Dunngeon (Aug 16, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*

I think they go out somewhere in August/September.


----------



## LeadDog17 (May 3, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*



jmooney said:


> Officer Dunngeon said:
> 
> 
> > Oh well, it's not like anyone's gonna be hired off this test anyway!
> ...


Ahhh, YES!!!! Those trick questions that test your grammar and attention to detail are a great idea - BUT when the rest of the test is full of grammar errors and typos and misplaced punctuation, it becomes difficult to decide if a given answer is the correct answer with typo or if the answer is wrong because the apparent typo is there to throw you off.



> On a side note can someone tell me why with all the technology the state has to its disposal why are they still using those awful drawings that look like they were drawn by a kid in Jr. High?


Again - lazy and wasteful - do it right or OUTSOURCE!!! Stupid, top heavy, bureaucracies like HRD are the reason GOOD, NECESSARY PO positions are being sent to the chopping block!

Also, Dunngie, you are right, you can't read too much into the questions. However, it can be difficult to stop yourself from reading too deep - People like the intelligent members of our masscops community have to STOP THINKING in order to play the game successfully. One really does not have to read very deep at all and they are reading TOO deep! There were several questions where I had to stop myself and just say "Eric, stop thinking, [the analysis] doesn't matter."
That is why they need EXPERTS to create an accurate test. One which accounts for the test takers and is styled in a manner to give an accurate picture of the examinees. The current test doesn't appear to have any measurable method of determining the quality of the test takers. It seems very easy for a moron like me to pull of a 100, while someone who is real bright, like Tomahawk, might get an 80! The test looked to me as though it was made the night before and kind of randomly thrown together. If a FEW people got together and made a professional test, everyone would be better off. By a few, I mean 6 or so testing professionals with LOTS of knowledge in the field as opposed to 100 idiots who are completely void of any intellect, let alone the psych background needed for the job.

Basically, Dunngie, I don't think you are over analyzing at all, there are some serious issues. OR, perhaps we are both (and many others, i think) over analyzing.

-Eric[/quote]


----------



## tomahawk (May 1, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*



LeadDog17 said:


> It seems very easy for a moron like me to pull of a 100, while someone who is real bright, like Tomahawk, might get an 80! The test looked to me as though it was made the night before and kind of randomly thrown together.


Hey is that a compliment!? WOO! That's going straight to my head. :shock:

And there is nothing wrong with throwing things together the night before... I happened to excel at it for four years of college!

-Mike


----------



## mcdonagh (Jul 24, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*

A few questions?

1) Where was the accident located in the memory section?

I put in front of Washington Park. I don't think it was on W. Elm and there was no such thing as Post Office Square??

2) The one about the cop who wanted to impress his supervisor and was 
trying to decide how to arrange a sentence.

Was the answer the one where the cop said he "detected an odor of smoldering Cannabis Sativa L. and noted on his chronometer that the time was 2:00 in the afternoon. 
OR

Was the answer the simpler version where the cop said I smelled marijuana and noted the time as 2:00 in the afternoon.

3) The one about the investigation process that stated police were investigating around 5 child abductions and the profile suggests that it was one perpetrator. Then it said that the length of the investigation was too long and that the process might not get to the next level, which was???

I said the #6 the Apprehension phase??


----------



## ROBOCOP1982 (Sep 4, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*



mcdonagh said:


> A few questions?
> 
> 1) Where was the accident located in the memory section?
> 
> ...


OK, 1. I put in front of Washington Park.
2. I put "I smelled marijuana and noted the time as 2:00 in the afternoon." (That is the appropriate way to say..but who knows with these people.)
3. I put that they could not get past the profile identity thing if they don't know who he is.

Then again...that's just in my humble opinion.


----------



## tomahawk (May 1, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*



mcdonagh said:


> A few questions?
> 
> 1) Where was the accident located in the memory section?
> 
> I put in front of Washington Park. I don't think it was on W. Elm and there was no such thing as Post Office Square??


Ok, here's my two cents on everything: The street was W. Elm, but the choice was E. Elm - which didn't exist. You chose the correct answer.



> 2) The one about the cop who wanted to impress his supervisor and was
> trying to decide how to arrange a sentence.
> 
> Was the answer the one where the cop said he "detected an odor of smoldering Cannabis Sativa L. and noted on his chronometer that the time was 2:00 in the afternoon.
> ...


Simpler one. Think realistically; the supervisor isn't going to be impressed with jibberish about your flux capacitor.



> 3) The one about the investigation process that stated police were investigating around 5 child abductions and the profile suggests that it was one perpetrator. Then it said that the length of the investigation was too long and that the process might not get to the next level, which was???
> 
> I said the #6 the Apprehension phase??


Yep. It was spelled out in the definition of the Apprehension phase. Good guess! 

Congrats to everyone who took the test today. Along with myself, you found a very boring and semi-frustrating way to waste fifty bucks! 

-Mike


----------



## COLE (Feb 7, 2003)

*Re: Good Luck*

Well I must say that this was my first test, and I don't think I did so hot.  Does anyone know how long it takes to get the results back? I'm already going out of my mind and it hasn't even been 24 hrs.


----------



## tomahawk (May 1, 2002)

*Re: Good Luck*



CLAF111 said:


> Well I must say that this was my first test, and I don't think I did so hot.  Does anyone know how long it takes to get the results back? I'm already going out of my mind and it hasn't even been 24 hrs.


Don't get your hopes up if you wanted to hear from HRD anytime soon. As others have posted, check your mailbox sometime in September. There is a slight chance that the website might have lists sooner, but I am not counting on that.

-Mike


----------



## Irish Wampanoag (Apr 6, 2003)

*Re: Good Luck*

Hi Guys,
I think the the Self discrimination was a typo mistake because I remember spending about 15 minutes on that question and the other three answers were absolutely wrong about Maranda rights. As for the speeding question that was confusing on what was arrestable speeding is arrestable and so is refusing to stop for a police officer which in the question he did because it stated he saw the officer's blue lights and drove faster. This question will probably be thrown out because it required you to have police knowledge about ch85/89/90 which this exam is an entrance exam.


----------



## Burner1 (Jul 30, 2002)

If I did not score near a 100% I'll be dissapointed (including my whopping 2 points for experience). Anyone have it in Haverhill? If you did, hopefully you did not have the "proctor" that I had. He had no clue to the directions of administrating the exam. Finally, the guy had to ask someone else for the correct directions. It was brutal! Hopefully he kept track of those envelopes, otherwise my 2 points just went down the Merrimac. As for the horrible grammar on the exam, there is a remedy. There were directions that you can write to the "Personnel Administrator" at HRD for descrepancies and/or complaints.


----------



## Foxracingmtnridr (Feb 23, 2003)

my favorite Questions were the one with the four descriptions and the only one that matched it was a Female that was 5'10" with short curly black hair when it was a guy that the had caught who was 5'10" with short curly black hair. and the other one was the pictures near the end with the fat bald guy and the disguise was him with a female wig and earrings and stuff on. :roll: Come on now HRD. 

If i don't get atleast a 95 or higher on this test I will definitely be :twisted: 

They have to stop having the whackjobs in the mental institution design these exams.

Just my two cents!! :shock: 

Scott


----------



## PMC810 (Aug 6, 2002)

Hpoe I do Good so I can get on the MBTA soon to be State Police - the best way to the good jobs is in who you know!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :twisted:


----------



## ROBOCOP1982 (Sep 4, 2002)

sapd324 said:


> my favorite Questions were the one with the four descriptions and the only one that matched it was a Female that was 5'10" with short curly black hair when it was a guy that the had caught who was 5'10" with short curly black hair.
> 
> Scott


Yeah...what was up with that. I put the female...the rest of the description matched.....


----------



## Crvtte65 (May 19, 2002)

Sometimes you just can't tell...

Remember SNL....It's PAT!!! :sq:


----------



## Danman1116 (May 7, 2002)

I was just on the HRD website and looks like you can go online to check your results but judging by what you guys are saying, they probably won't have the results posted up any sooner then you would normally hear by. Oh well...I'm not getting my hopes up too much on this exam...I think that overall I did ok, but as was said earlier, it really depends on where you live. 
At least I have somewhat of a backup plan...and thats being an MP in USAF, more then likely the Reserves up in Chicopee...at least I'll be practicing law enforcement somewhere :?

Oh yea, meant to ask, whats up with the PAT, the proctor we had had mentioned something about it but I'm kinda clueless as to what he was talking about. I know its the Physical Abilities Test, but when/how do we take it? Do we have to wait to hear from the HRD before we have to start worrying about it?


----------



## bjm (Jan 4, 2003)

Did anyone else take the test at North Quincy. The proctor I had didn't know how to administer the memorization part of the exam. People that took the exam before had to tell him that you got 5 minutes to memorize then he was to take the paper away and we would then have a 5 minute waiting period. The best part was that after our 5 minute study period he forgot to collect the papers until 2-3 minutes later. It was a complete joke. The guy had no idea what he was doing.


----------



## Gil (Jun 15, 1998)

Danman1116 said:


> Oh yea, meant to ask, whats up with the PAT, the proctor we had had mentioned something about it but I'm kinda clueless as to what he was talking about. I know its the Physical Abilities Test, but when/how do we take it? Do we have to wait to hear from the HRD before we have to start worrying about it?


Dan,

Most likely you would take the PAT after.

1. Application
2. Interview
3. Background check
4. Oral board
5. Conditional offer of employment.

Then they would setup a date for medical, psychiatric exam and PAT


----------



## Officer Dunngeon (Aug 16, 2002)

And if you do make it to that point, you first run 4 laps around an obstacle couse where:

1. the first lap you have to drive under a bar about 1 1/2 feet off the ground 
2. second lap you run up and down a flight of stairs
3. third lap you jump through a window
4. and fourth lap you climb over a 5'2" wall.

You then run through a series of cones over to a machine where you have to tackle a weight bag to the floor and then to the other side of the machine where you simulate handcuffing, by bringing these two weighted bars together. I think you have 2mintues and 40 seconds to do this.

There is also a dummy drag. I think the dummy weighs 150 lbs. but I forget and I think you have to pull it 25 feet.

Also the trigger pull, where you have to shoot six times in each hand in 7 (?) seconds.

Anything else I forgot to mention?


----------



## Danman1116 (May 7, 2002)

doesn't seem like thats too bad as long as your in shape...we'll see probably in about 6 months when they give the results back :wink:


----------



## Tackleberry22 (Dec 21, 2002)

I think i did pretty good myself, some of the answers to a few questions were messed up. It will be interesting to see what happens from this test; hope for the best.


----------



## SPDHunter (May 1, 2002)

I know it must sound like I am beating the dead horse here, but for the red light/speeding question there was the word "chase" in the paragraph explaining the scenario. Above the scenario was the definitions portion, where it explained "fresh and continued pursuit". I too, like many of you, sat there for about 15 minutes debating about the question. The answer that I selected was "A" that he was correct in making the arrest. But that is just my interpretation.


----------



## Anonymous (Jan 1, 1970)

*Re: Good Luck*



union1 said:


> I also saw MANY questions that did not give enough information to make even a correct assumption. I did spend 20 minutes on the DISCRIMINATION one thinking there was something I missed. Overall tho the test was a bit harder this time around.
> 
> I plan on writing a letter about #69 to HRD. That was bullshit. Does anyone know if you can get a copy of the test incase you wanted to appeal a question you dont remmeber the number or correct wording for?


I don't think you are able to get a copy of the test remeber how anal they were about you giving the test back and before you could leave the room the proctor had to count all the pages to make sure you didn't steal any 
They are really starting to outdo themselves


----------



## Easton (Apr 16, 2003)

your missing the point of the question you cant even stop the vehicle for a minor moving violation because it didnt happen in your town so you cant make the arrest or the stop.


----------



## Officer Dunngeon (Aug 16, 2002)

Yes, you can make the stop because the violation occurred before he crossed the town line. The passage said that he blew the stop light and *then* drove into the next town.

At least that's what I recall...


----------



## tomahawk (May 1, 2002)

Correct, Dungie, that is how it was worded.

HOWEVER, I still stick to my defense of "don't read anything into the question other than what they presented." Knowing if failure to stop / speeding / failure to obey are arrestable seem outside the scope of this test, IMHO.

-Mike


----------



## Tackleberry22 (Dec 21, 2002)

The arrest for the speeder was correct. The officer activated his blue lights in his town, the driver speed up; didn't pull over until going into the other town. Under Chp.90 s21 falling to stop when signalled is an arrestable offense. That's how I chose my answer for that question.


----------



## Tackleberry22 (Dec 21, 2002)

:evil: Damn it, to tired. Scratch out Falling and replace with FAILING


----------

