# Paramedic Preference



## DVET1979 (Aug 4, 2004)

I was fortunate enough to take the P.A.T. for the fire department and was recently hired by my hometown largely due to my dvet status. I do have some advice for those non-vets who are desperate to get on any civil service job and willing to work for it. I took the P.A.T. with several state certified paramedics who received multiple cards from many different municipalities. The highest number of cards issued to one candidate was nine. THAT IS WITHOUT VET STATUS! If anyone has any other questions then just post'em.


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## 7MPOC (Mar 16, 2004)

DVET1979 said:


> I was fortunate enough to take the P.A.T. for the fire department and was recently hired by my hometown largely due to my dvet status. I do have some advice for those non-vets who are desperate to get on any civil service job and willing to work for it. I took the P.A.T. with several state certified paramedics who received multiple cards from many different municipalities. The highest number of cards issued to one candidate was nine. THAT IS WITHOUT VET STATUS! If anyone has any other questions then just post'em.


Only Police Departments who run the ambulance for the town can use emt selective status. It is mainly used by fire departments, I dont know of many police departments that run the ambulance usually its towns that have on-call fire fighters. Also you only have 4 choices for civil service towns, so unless the same town kept hiring over and over I dont see anyone getting nine cards.


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## DVET1979 (Aug 4, 2004)

It does not matter if you only have 4 choices, I recall a short time after taking the fire examin 04 that WESTWOOD FIRE DEPARTMENT sent cards to almost everyone who take the fire exam, including myself who's not a paramedic, asking for people to bring in a copy of their paramedics license if they had one. If a municipality has a desperate need for a paramedic or needs to fill a certain special skill, they may draw from everyone who took the test due to lack of special skill candidates on their list.


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## laxball33 (Mar 23, 2004)

Is this a police or fire forum? Don't the smokies have their own forum? Any cop who takes training in emt or paramedics if their town doesn't require or gives incentive for it is only opening themselves up for easier lawsuits. Use the first responder training and be happy with it.


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## Guest (Jan 4, 2006)

laxball33 said:


> Is this a police or fire forum? Don't the smokies have their own forum? Any cop who takes training in emt or paramedics if their town doesn't require or gives incentive for it is only opening themselves up for easier lawsuits. Use the first responder training and be happy with it.


:dito:


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## DVET1979 (Aug 4, 2004)

Yes, the smokies do have thier own, or should I now say OUR own forum, but I know that civil service jobs whether they be police or fire are hard to come by. I too was aspiring to become a police officer, but the fire department gave me my shot first, and Ithought anyone aspiring to become a police officer that was frustrated about not getting on the job may have found my information useful. So instead of spending many frustrating years on campus, hospital, or Boston Special pd I thought I throw an alternative out if people want to make a switch.Also down the line if I do get a job with the police all of my time with civil service will carry over to include payscale and seniority, just so long as the police job I take is with civil service as well.


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## billj (Aug 28, 2004)

DVET1979 said:


> Yes, the smokies do have thier own, or should I now say OUR own forum, but I know that civil service jobs whether they be police or fire are hard to come by. I too was aspiring to become a police officer, but the fire department gave me my shot first, and Ithought anyone aspiring to become a police officer that was frustrated about not getting on the job may have found my information useful. So instead of spending many frustrating years on campus, hospital, or Boston Special pd I thought I throw an alternative out if people want to make a switch.Also down the line if I do get a job with the police all of my time with civil service will carry over to include payscale and seniority, just so long as the police job I take is with civil service as well.


Congatulations, DVET. Where did you get hired?


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## mooseb61 (Nov 8, 2005)

Dvet, what fire forum do you visit?


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## DVET1979 (Aug 4, 2004)

I haven't been able to find it myself but I do know ne exists, I


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## DVET1979 (Aug 4, 2004)

I'll PM you when I find out


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## KozmoKramer (Apr 25, 2004)

Moose - here is a popular one:
http://forums.firehouse.com/


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## DVET1979 (Aug 4, 2004)

Thanks Kozmo


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## mooseb61 (Nov 8, 2005)

KozmoKramer said:


> Moose - here is a popular one:
> http://forums.firehouse.com/


Thanks Koz


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## j809 (Jul 5, 2002)

No department in their right mind would want to hire a paramedic. That means every time you respond to an accident and any call that someone is injured, you have the highests level of care, even above EMTs. Which means you CANNOT transfer authority, except to someone higher or equal to you. It would create a nightmare. I also heard this problem come up with departments that have officers as EMTs.


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## mopar6972 (May 6, 2003)

A police officer on duty who happens to be a paramedic is not going to be considered the highest level of care for a variety of reasons. One, I dont know about any of the other paramedics who happen to be cops, but I dont happen to carry a cardiac monitor, drugs or intuabtion equipment with me... So, in theory I cant even provide paramedic level ALS care.. Two massachusetts ems protocols specifically state paramedics should work in pairs ( unless paramedic- basic waiver) in which case they can work as a single unit.. If an agency is not paramedic level, that paramedic can only perform skills at the emt-intermediate level..Each region is also responsible for their protocols, and each agency must have direct medical oversight. Unless a police agency has specific paramedic responsibilites, there is no medical oversight, and therefore the paramedic is really reduced to that of an emt. ( just because your agency has a MD as medical direction, MSP for instance.. does not grant a paramedic the ability to act as such..) In this situation there really is not a higher level of care because the paramedic cannot use the skills..
In agencies with basic EMT's it really should not be a problem as eventually youre gong to have to transfer to an ambulance which has to have at least one EMT.. Not a police officers responsibility at that point..( unless of course, the police are the primary "ambulance")


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## j809 (Jul 5, 2002)

I just got out of in-service today and they told us that the highest level of care is meant by the highest trained there. If four cops show up on the accident and two are first responders, one is an EMT and one is a paramedic, the paramedic is the one with the highest level of care and cannot leave until relieved by someone equal or higher. That was brought up today at inservice at Refresher First Responder by the instructors. It has nothing to do with the equipment you have available.


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## mopar6972 (May 6, 2003)

I disagree. If you read the protocols, you can not act as a paramedic, without proper medical control, which has nothign to do with equipment. No first responder police agency has the authorization to provide the level of care. If you are responding as a paramedic with a licensed ambulance company..and not a police officer, then yes, you are stuck. If you are responding as a police officer who happens to be a paramedic, you are a first responder/EMT. Big difference..

heres the CMR's 105 170.00 ems regulations

first Responder.. 105 171.00

It clearly states that a first responder agency such as fire, or police, are not EMS first responders, which are licensed as ambulance providers...

In light of that, a police officer who is a paramedic, may not provide paramedic level service, as they are not a member of an EMS first responder agency..

The higher level of care doesnt matter, youre not licensed to provide care through a EFR....

I'm not sure where the info is coming from, Im a First responder instructor and Ive not heard of this..


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## wordstew (Jul 29, 2002)

I know a few officers who are registered nurse. How does this apply to them??


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## mopar6972 (May 6, 2003)

wordstew said:


> I know a few officers who are registered nurse. How does this apply to them??


 Im not entirely sure how that would apply to to nurses. Nurses are completely governed by a separate entity, not OEMS. Although if a nurse wants to work on a critical care ambulance, or as a flight nurse they need to certified as an EMT....


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## wordstew (Jul 29, 2002)

My understanding is that a nurse who works on a critical care ambulance or as a flight nurse become EMT-P is so they can administer certain rescue meds without calling for MD order. I'm just curious who is considered in charge if an EMT responds and a Police officer whio is also an RN responds.


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## Nachtwächter (Dec 9, 2005)

The EMT is in charge of the patient most RNs are not trained to treat people in the field. Paramedics have more practical training than a RN. Such as intubation, ACLS and don't need a docs orders to push most meds.


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## mopar6972 (May 6, 2003)

wordstew said:


> My understanding is that a nurse who works on a critical care ambulance or as a flight nurse become EMT-P is so they can administer certain rescue meds without calling for MD order. I'm just curious who is considered in charge if an EMT responds and a Police officer whio is also an RN responds.


 The minimum staffing requirements for a critical care ambulance is one RN who is at least an EMT -basic, and a second EMT who is a paramedic ( not including the driver). there are other options, but that is the basic requirement. 
In regards to your second question. it would depend on how the EMT is responding, are they part of the ambulance service, or just somebody stopping to help. If thats the situation, then the PO ( as a first responder) can tell the help to go pound sand. If its an ambulance company, then the EMT's are in control...


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