# Bush's Presidency



## Irish Wampanoag (Apr 6, 2003)

"W" has a little more than a week left. I feel Bush legacy got a raw deal having to deal with 9/11 and the after years. I feel Bush is what the country needed during these years however to some not the what the country wanted. I believe in 30, 40 years he will be look back on as good if not great president. 

Give me some opinions on what you believe!!!

Please I am really not interested in how Obama is going to screw up the country etc.. would like to keep the opinions on "W" only. Thanks


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## Big.G (Nov 28, 2006)

Irish Wampanoag said:


> "W" has a little more than a week left. I feel Bush legacy got a raw deal having to deal with 9/11 and the after years. I feel Bush is what the country needed during these years however to some not the what the country wanted.


That's why he got reelected in 2004. Things went downhill for him after 2004.


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## silva (Mar 10, 2006)

This guy is the biggest piece of garbage to live in the White House in a long time....I'd love to know how you'd justify him being a great President....I'm not saying Obama will be any better because only time will tell...


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## BrickCop (Dec 23, 2004)

His 9/11- Afghanistan response was excellent but he lost me when his relentless hard on for Iraq overshadowed it.


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## Beowolf (Jan 27, 2006)

If you view the aspects of our financial debt (12trillion), the state of the economy, lost jobs, the war and the long toll it will take on soldiers, families, long term health care and mental health, emotional problems, reputation with other countries, occupying iraq for almost 7 yrs while saying he didnt want to be a nation builder as well as the secretive activities, AG debacles, he probably is one of the worst overall presidents we had.

Of course there havent been any attacks since 9/11, so that also deserves praise, By and large, i think with the exception of friends, family and some co-workers and some at fox news, he has been a poor president


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## Guest (Jan 12, 2009)

anyone that demands laws made out of religious beliefs has no place in politics.


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## Guest (Jan 12, 2009)

FDR and Truman have been praised by historians as bold leaders who took down a dictator who murdered millions of innocent people.

Was there really much difference between Adolf Hitler and Saddam Hussein?



Caleb Ragnarok said:


> anyone that demands laws made out of religious beliefs has no place in politics.


Our country was founded on religious beliefs, my friend.


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## BrickCop (Dec 23, 2004)

Delta784 said:


> Was there really much difference between Adolf Hitler and Saddam Hussein?


While both were evil, one was contained while the other ran amok invading dozens of other countries, I think that's a big difference. Hussein was not the threat to the US that Bush made him out to be. Now we are treating Iraq like our 51st state, blowing taxpayer billions on ungrateful primitives.



> Our country was founded on religious beliefs, my friend.


+1 How quickly we forget.


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## justanotherparatrooper (Aug 27, 2006)

I was never impressed by his father, I had higher hopes for him. I felt his response to 911 was correct as was his taking action against Saddam Hussein.
I was very disappointed in how much he kowtowed to the demorats in both the House and Senate.He really pissed me off with his actions on ILLEGALS coming into our country and the bailouts.


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## Guest (Jan 12, 2009)

BrickCop said:


> While both were evil, one was contained while the other ran amok invading dozens of other countries, I think that's a big difference.


Not for lack of trying; he was at war with Iran for 8 years, and have we forgotten about him attempting to annex Kuwait? His goal was always to seize the oil fields of the Middle East, and bring the US to its knees economically. It's just that his military sucked that he failed in that goal.


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## Guest (Jan 12, 2009)

Delta784 said:


> Our country was founded on religious beliefs, my friend.


"Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof," thus building a wall of separation between Church & State." - Thomas Jefferson

Our nation was born on the principal of religious freedom and against religious persecution.

"When Fascism comes to America it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross" - Sinclair Lewis


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## HousingCop (May 14, 2004)

*Harry Truman was villified for decades after he ordered the dropping the A-Bombs on the Japanese. Would we rather that hundreds of thousands of US soldiers be killed or wounded storming the beaches being defended by Japanese civilians with pitchforks and gasoline or end it swiftly with only casualties on the people who started the war to begin with? Now, Truman ranks right up there as one of the better presidents. *
*Think of how many of us on this board would not have even been born had the A-Bombs not been dropped?? *

*Hussein DID have biological weapons and did hide them from UN inspectors. The UN had 14 resolutions for him to disarm. I give Kudos to GW for standing up and following a UN MANDATE. If the UN had any stones, they would have acted after the third one when Hussein kicked out the UN weapons inspectors. But let's not forget that Kofi's boys in the UN and his family, along with the French & Russians were skimming from the Oil4Food program. The fish rots from the head down at the UN.*

*They've found several bio weapons shells in IED's which have exploded on our troops but thankfully, did not mix correctly to cause immediate harm. Where the other WMD's went is a big mystery. Hint.... those 14 convoys going into the Bekaa Valley in Syria were only delivering pizza, along with the several airplanes full of WMD munitions.*

*Once the actual truth comes out in a few years, you'll see that GW was right all along. Weather you agree with his policies or not, he made an unpopular decision and stuck by it. He didn't take a poll to see which way the political winds were shifting like the previous president from Arkansas did. *

*Caleb, reread your quote you posted.*


> "Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof," thus building a wall of separation between Church & State." - Thomas Jefferson


*What that actually means is that the the founding fathers did not want the Government to establish ONE religion for all to worship. We are free to worship as we please and that the government shall not interfere in your worshiping techniques. The above quote by Delta* _"Our country was founded on religious beliefs, my friend."_ *still rings true. Just because you worship the ganga, doesn't mean that I have to as well. Your act is tiring. Beep beeep, what's that I hear coming???*


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## Guest (Jan 12, 2009)

Truman was right! He made the right call at the right time and saves many, many lives. 

Ford was right when he pardoned Nixon. It was the right thing to do at that time. America did not need a long draw-out public trial of its former president. There was work to do and Ford knew it. And by doing so he doomed his political name.

Back in the early 90's we pulled out of Iraq with the job half done. Elder bush should have finished the job when he started it

and Dubya was not right in his invasion of Iraq. The Afghan invasion was the correct response. Thats where Osama was and thats where we had to go.


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## Guest (Jan 13, 2009)

Caleb Ragnarok said:


> "Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between Man & his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legitimate powers of government reach actions only, & not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should "make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof," thus building a wall of separation between Church & State." - Thomas Jefferson


There's a huge difference between freedom OF religion, and freedom FROM religion.



HousingCop said:


> *Think of how many of us on this board would not have even been born had the A-Bombs not been dropped??*


An invasion of mainland Japan would have taken place in 1946-47, and considering my father graduated high school in 1946, I think it's obvious where I stand on that issue.


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## Guest (Jan 13, 2009)

exactly.. freedom OF religion is one of the founding ideas of this country. 
a religious belief is very subjective. and no, the law was established to allow everyone their own choice in religion, or free from persecution thereof.

My grandfather was at okinawa and was getting ready to go do some more island hopping until the Elona Gay dropped its payload.



HousingCop said:


> * Just because you worship the ganga, doesn't mean that I have to as well. Your act is tiring. Beep beeep, what's that I hear coming???*


Please sir, ask about someones religious beliefs before assuming. 
beep beep.. I think its this guy you hear.


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## Loyal (Oct 21, 2007)

Bush inherited a recession. He cut our taxes, interest rates and unemployment were at record lows during his administration. The DOW reached record highs.. 9/11 changed a lot- we had to take Iraq on after that. Intelligence agencies from around the world also believed he had weapons of mass destruction, he had used them on the Kurds, he ignored 14 UN resolutions...we had to step up and finally take on terrorist nations..it has only been the last year that the economy tanked..and it is a global problem. Barney Frank and Chris Dodd are far more to blame than President Bush for the economy..having a demorat House and Senate certainly have not helped his Presidency..it was nice having an honest man as President after Clinton dishonored it, repeatedly during his 8 years with scandal after scandal


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## TacEntry (Nov 29, 2006)

George W. Bush has had the intestinal fortitude to make hard decisions and stick by them. I feel he has done what has to be done to keep America safe and to do what has to be done in the Middle East. Afghanistan was essential. If we didn't stop Saddam, who would have? Thats right - no one. 14 UN Resolutions, with nothing done - Saddam laughed at us for years throughout the Clinton Administration. The UN stands for Useless Nations. It wouldn't have mattered what happened with the UN over there - nobody was going to do anything. Russia, France - both neck deep in profitting from the ridiculous Oil4Food Program. 
Gdubya did what America wasn't ready for in 91'. He finished off a tyrants regime. As mentioned before - Saddam had Bio Weapons - used 'em to kill thousands of Kurds, and thats a well known fact. The UN Inspector program was a joke and would never have worked with the stranglehold Saddam had on Iraq. Those Inspectors never had a chance and that was one big dog and pony show. War is hard folks. Sorry.


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## CJIS (Mar 12, 2005)

I place half blame for failures over the past several years on Congress as well.


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## BrickCop (Dec 23, 2004)

HousingCop said:


> *Once the actual truth comes out in a few years, you'll see that GW was right all along. Weather you agree with his policies or not, he made an unpopular decision and stuck by it. He didn't take a poll to see which way the political winds were shifting like the previous president from Arkansas did. *


Bush himself has recently publicly lamented that his intell was off about the WMD. No big deal to me as he went in on good faith. I voted for the guy twice but this continued support of making Iraq a welfare state is ridiculous.


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## Guest (Jan 13, 2009)

USMCMP5811 said:


> That wasn't the mission, the mission was to make sadam to with draw from Kuwait unconditionaly, which is what we did.


Pressing forward into Iraq would have fractured the delicate coalition (who would have thought we'd be allied with Syria?) and created a political and diplomatic mess.

And considering I came home without a scratch, I think we stopped at just the right time.


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## Guest (Jan 13, 2009)

USMCMP5811 said:


> As far as George W. Bush, since 9/11, there has never been another attack on our soil. I'm scared as to what is going to happen after the next 8 days.


So using the same logic, Washington, Adams(Father and Son), Jefferson, Jackson, Grant, Johnson, L.B.J., Carter, Ford, Nixon, Clinton, Truman, Roosevelt, Hoover, Wilson, Taft, McKinley, Harrison(both grandfather and grandson), etc..etc...Did a great job because there wasn't an attack from a foreign entity on domestic soil during these presidencies.


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## Guest (Jan 13, 2009)

Caleb Ragnarok said:


> So using the same logic, Washington, Adams(Father and Son), Jefferson, Jackson, Grant, Johnson, L.B.J., Carter, Ford, Nixon, Clinton, Truman, Roosevelt, Hoover, Wilson, Taft, McKinley, Harrison(both grandfather and grandson), etc..etc...Did a great job because there wasn't an attack from a foreign entity on domestic soil during these presidencies.


You can't compare apples to moonrocks; as recently as Ford, there weren't Islamofacists hell-bent on killing American infidels. They started planning and rehearsing during the Reagan administration.


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## Guest (Jan 13, 2009)

say that to the hostages that were in Tehran during the end of Carter's term and the start of reagan.

Islamofacists.. Didn't they have those during the holy crusades?


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## HousingCop (May 14, 2004)

Caleb Ragnarok said:


> So using the same logic, Washington, Adams(Father and Son), Jefferson, Jackson, Grant, Johnson, L.B.J., Carter, Ford, Nixon, Clinton, Truman, Roosevelt, Hoover, Wilson, Taft, McKinley, Harrison(both grandfather and grandson), etc..etc...Did a great job because there wasn't an attack from a foreign entity on domestic soil during these presidencies.


*Check your facts RagCock, there was a little thing called Pearl Harbor during Roosevelt's administration. Ever heard of it? *

*How about the first attack on the WTC in NY under the Klinton administration? Never mind the Kobar Tower, USS Cole, several overseas US embasy bombings in Africa, et al. All are considered US soil even if overseas. *

*The 444 days of disgrace under Carter when the Islamo-nuts took over out embassy in Iran. By the way, they released those hostages hours before Reagan was sworn in. They knew an asskicking was in the works if they kept them any longer. *

*I guess those stubborn things called FACTS are awful tough and get in the way of your logic sometimes. *


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## Guest (Jan 13, 2009)

HousingCop said:


> *Check your facts RagCock, there was a little thing called Pearl Harbor during Roosevelt's administration. Ever heard of it? *
> 
> *How about the first attack on the WTC in NY under the Klinton administration? Never mind the Kobar Tower, USS Cole, several overseas US embasy bombings in Africa, et al. All are considered US soil even if overseas. *
> 
> ...


Um.. you are aware that we've had to Roosevelts as presidents right?? Teddy wasn't fighting the Japs.. He'd rather remember the Maine and fight with the rough riders

@ wolfman... S'ok my wife has TONS!!!


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## OfficerObie59 (Sep 14, 2007)

When Bush took office, I was a bleeding heart liberal, just finshing high school. After an Army enlistment, a college education, a few years in law enforcement, and posting here, my views have changed quite a bit. So I find it difficult to judge the guys entire presidency, as I actually have to judge certain parts of it all over again with the wee bit more maturity I have now. And no doubt, what we write on this board will be reevaluated for decades to come, as opinions change with a seasoning of time.

Bush's 9/11 response was textbook of how I want a President to respond to an incident like that. I disagree with comments of people who say that he got a bum wrap with 9/11: He's the president. It's his job and duty to deal with catastrophic situations such as that.

I think that this was, is, and will always be his crowning acheivement, as unfortunate as it was. I hope history will remember that part. The same with the invasion of Afghanistan. While I credit him with what we've done so far, I also fault him for what we haven't done so far. We've taken our eye off the ball and are now trying to make up lost time.

As for Iraq, I don't think we should've done it to begin with. IMHO, Iraq was not a clear and present danger at the time we went in. Not to say that it never should have been addressed at some point or that we shouldn't have invaded at a later date, but the timing was wrong and the post-invasion planning was nearly non-existant. We kept throwing stuff at the wall hoping it would stick. The glue was finally "the Surge". 

With that said, I'm sick of people blaming the lack of WMD's on Bush. The whole world community--including France!--thought Saddam had them. And when I was in western Iraq in 03' all the locals said the same thing: "They took 'em to Syria on big trucks days before the invasion." This doesn't mean there weren't intel failures; there certainly were. But I think they were mainly a result of the adminstration telling Bush what he wanted to hear.

Katrina: Not his fault. There's only so much you can do if the local and state government don't ask you for help. FEMA had too much red tape, much of it congressionally mandated.

Immigration: Tried to cater too much too the other side.

Social Security: Didn't cater enough. You have to make some concessions sometimes if you want your agenda to take. While privatization may have been a decent idea, it's a political 3rd rail.

The TARP bailout: Don't get me started. I think it had to be done, but the execution was deplorable.

He's done some good and not so good; I think he came out around par. How history will judge him is anyone's guess.

in closing, I know I won't garner any goodwill from the the true conservatives of MassCops, but I liked and voted for John McCain because he was and always has been John McCain (at least before campaign aids changed him into the antithisis of what he was)--not because he was the lesser of two evils. It's a shame such a great man won't get to lead this country. I don't loose any sleep over the prospect of the next four years (oaky, well, maybe I cling to my gun while I sleep), but I certainly don't support the man taking over in 6 days.


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## Guest (Jan 13, 2009)

OfficerObie59 said:


> When Bush took office, I was a bleeding heart liberal, just finshing high school. After an Army enlistment, a college education, a few years in law enforcement, and posting here, my views have changed quite a bit. So I find it difficult to judge the guys entire presidency, as I actually have to judge certain parts of it all over again with the wee bit more maturity I have now. And no doubt, what we write on this board will be reevaluated for decades to come, as opinions change with a seasoning of time.
> 
> 1. Bush's 9/11 response was textbook of how I want a President to respond to an incident like that. I disagree with comments of people who say that he got a bum wrap with 9/11: He's the president. It's his job and duty to deal with catastrophic situations such as that.
> 
> ...


1. textbook? Was that what he was reading when he found out about the attacks?? I thought it was a children's book. A good response would be to give his apologies and excuse oneself because the nation needed its leader.

2.I agree with what you say about the Afghan invasion.

3. perfectly said!!

4. Here is what he needed on his desk for this Katrina/FEMA thing.. I'm sure the Truman family would have been ok to see it back on the oval office desk.


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## OfficerObie59 (Sep 14, 2007)

It bothers me that we agree so much. Just for the record, I classify (but do not register) myself as mostly a libertarian--or more specifically, someone who believes in the Constitution. Sometimes those views overlap with liberals, more often they don't.



Caleb Ragnarok said:


> 1. textbook? Was that what he was reading when he found out about the attacks?? I thought it was a children's book. A good response would be to give his apologies and excuse oneself because the nation needed its leader.


Big deal, he was reading to school children. Will that be above Obama's pay grade?

9/11 took years of planning, but occured 8 months into his presidency. If you're gonna get into pre-attack failures, blame Clinton for 90% of it.


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## 7costanza (Aug 29, 2006)

> It bothers me that we agree so much.


Really your heroes are Hillary clinton , Jon Delorean and an overrated community organizer to.


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## OfficerObie59 (Sep 14, 2007)

Which community organizer? Vladimir Lenin?


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## 7costanza (Aug 29, 2006)




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## HousingCop (May 14, 2004)

*RagCock,*
*I am well aware that there were 2 different Roosevelt's who served as Presidents. In your above post you reminded us of both the two different Harrisons' and Adams' administrations. How was I to know you were reffering to Teddy R. instead of Franklin D. R. ? Be more specific next time. I can read your writings, not your mind.*

*Both Roosevelts had their own dealings with foreign entities who attacked us. The Battleship Maine in Cuba at port in Havana Harbor was supposedly sabotaged which lead to the Spanish-American War, but about 90 years later proven false. There is no denying that Japan attacked us unprovoked which entered us into WW2. *

*As Wolfman says, you're outa' shoes.*


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## OfficerObie59 (Sep 14, 2007)

7costanza said:


> Really your heroes are Hillary clinton , Jon Delorean and an overrated community organizer to.





OfficerObie59 said:


> Which community organizer? Vladimir Lenin?





7costanza said:


>


Just to clarify, I was joking that Caleb and Obama are communists.


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## 7costanza (Aug 29, 2006)

> Just to clarify, I was joking that Caleb and Obama are communists.


Just to clarify I hate Hillary, Obama and Delorean.


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## OfficerObie59 (Sep 14, 2007)

7costanza said:


> Just to clarify I hate Hillary, Obama and Delorean.


No argument here.


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## Guest (Jan 13, 2009)

OfficerObie59 said:


> Just to clarify, I was joking that Caleb and Obama are communists.


DAMNIT!!! I've been caught..

dasvidanya


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## Guest (Jan 13, 2009)

No other president had such a serious attack on American soil, there was no precident for what Bush had to do. Afganistain was a no brainer we had to go there we made a mistake with not taking care of Bin Laden when we had his holed up in the mountains. We relied on other people to do our work. Iraq is a question to me, I think Bush really believed that there were WMD in Iraq. Someone earlier said that the WMD are in Syira or buried in the desert. I think in reality there wasn't as many of them as we thought and that many were blown up in the first gulf war. (think of all the service men with strange maladies coming home from the gulf war) If he was able to pull Iraq off and put a democratic government there that would have been a good thing. We were led to believe by many inside Iraq that that is want they wanted.
The economy crash is not just Bushes fault, I think there is plenty of blame for this all around the dial. Only history will tell if it was a good presidency or not.


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## RCS (Jan 3, 2005)

When I think about Bush, I think about him with the firemen standing around the ruins in NYC on 9/11. People forget about that, I guess time heals all wounds, but on that day I knew that Bush would take care of business.



Anyone ever think if Gore had to deal with that mess?


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## Foxy85 (Mar 29, 2006)

Caleb Ragnarok said:


> exactly.. freedom OF religion is one of the founding ideas of this country.
> a religious belief is very subjective. and no, the law was established to allow everyone their own choice in religion, or free from persecution thereof.
> 
> My grandfather was at okinawa and was getting ready to go do some more island hopping until the *Elona Gay* dropped its payload.
> ...


Elona the gay sad clown









Enola Gay - Badass Bomber


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## Guest (Jan 13, 2009)

B-E-A-Utiful!!!!


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## Guest (Jan 14, 2009)

Back on topic

Just in from yahoo news


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## TacEntry (Nov 29, 2006)

Caleb Ragnarok said:


> Back on topic
> 
> Just in from yahoo news


You got some crappy sources kid. Maybe AOL or CNN or MSNBC have some more goodies like that gem. BOOOOOOORING!


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## Guest (Jan 14, 2009)

eh.. just surfin....


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## BrickCop (Dec 23, 2004)

Did Bush pardon those two Border Patrol agents yet? Time is running out. If not I hope they get transferred to Gitmo since Obama is going to free 'em all soon.


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## REILEYDOG (Nov 5, 2005)

_


OCKS said:



No other president had such a serious attack on American soil, there was no precident for what Bush had to do. Afganistain was a no brainer we had to go there we made a mistake with not taking care of Bin Laden when we had his holed up in the mountains. We relied on other people to do our work. Iraq is a question to me, I think Bush really believed that there were WMD in Iraq. Someone earlier said that the WMD are in Syira or buried in the desert. I think in reality there wasn't as many of them as we thought and that many were blown up in the first gulf war. (think of all the service men with strange maladies coming home from the gulf war) If he was able to pull Iraq off and put a democratic government there that would have been a good thing. We were led to believe by many inside Iraq that that is want they wanted.
The economy crash is not just Bushes fault, I think there is plenty of blame for this all around the dial. Only history will tell if it was a good presidency or not.

Click to expand...

_There were WMD. Read "Saddam's Secrets" by General Georges Sada. He even gives the dates that they were flown out of Iraq and into Syria on commercial flights. General Sada was the commander of the Iraqi Airforce for most of the late '80's, 90's and 2000's.


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