# Another One Bites The Dust



## cjmajor (Feb 3, 2006)

Just one more town out of the civil service system. Too bad the Civil Service Commission couldn't realize their faults and make the agency better.....

http://acton.wickedlocal.com/article/20150813/NEWS/150818098


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## Bloodhound (May 20, 2010)

The reality is that the state doesn't want Civil Service to exist. That is evident by the massive cuts in their funding and personnel over the last decade. I wouldn't expect them to exist for all that much longer.


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## Pvt. Cowboy (Jan 26, 2005)

Probably a good move. No absurd delays waiting for scores if you need bodies. 

It looks like it's moving more towards a complete self-sponsor system.


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## pahapoika (Nov 5, 2006)

Stand by for more politics.

For example it's bad enough when mumbles gets his kid on the Boston PD with civil service in place. Can't imagine the shenanigans without it.

Maybe for the smaller towns, but if the cities go rouge, without the right connections regular guys will never get hired 

My humble .02


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## Edmizer1 (Aug 27, 2006)

cjmajor said:


> Just one more town out of the civil service system. Too bad the Civil Service Commission couldn't realize their faults and make the agency better.....
> 
> http://acton.wickedlocal.com/article/20150813/NEWS/150818098


Its not civil service's fault, they are playing by the rules set down for them to follow. Several years ago, an exiting CS commissioner wrote a long article in the Boston Globe spelling out the publically what we all know are the problems. I remember him saying that Boston Police was in the process of hiring a class at the time and that only 1 person out of the top 500 scorers was being considered for the class due to the CS rules in place.


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## RodneyFarva (Jan 18, 2007)

Where I work, I love all the guys and gals I work with they are my family and friends. and if I was still on the road, I would gladly breach any door knowing they would behind me. They are all great people however some (...and only a very few) should not be in law enforcement and are there because they test really well.


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## new guy (Sep 16, 2005)

The article says that they could hire an Officer in a month. I'm not sure how that would be possible between interviewing, taking a psych test,


Pvt. Cowboy said:


> Probably a good move. No absurd delays waiting for scores if you need bodies.
> 
> It looks like it's moving more towards a complete self-sponsor system.


The article says that they could hire an Officer in a month. Between interviewing, taking a psych test, medical screening, and the background investigation, I'm not sure that's possible unless they cut a few corners.


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## felony (Oct 24, 2014)

Most of you know that I am pro-CS. The towns where I have friends on the job, are all basically being bribed by the selectmen during negotiation time, for either Quinn bill education incentive for those that don't have it or a one time payment of $1000 or more per officer to vote out of it. MASSCOP will only do so much for you and the town administrator/selectmen will now able to impose their will, their is little you can do about it. 

For those that bitched about the CS test, will now take no name exams, for various police departments and will never hear back. Even if overly qualified, for the simple reason, that towns will hire who they want. This is a animal we have created and in part, CS has created by failing to generate a test and exam guidelines, that are more in line with the rest of the country.


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## felony (Oct 24, 2014)

woodyd said:


> Only possibility that I could see would be if they're hiring people who are already OTJ (sort of like hiring laterals through CS). That might allow for a lighter med/psych, provided the prior employer already did one, and a more focused background, looking more at the applicant's performance at their current job. I think its a very bad idea to cut corners on backgrounds, but I could see it happening that way.
> In some ways, lateral transfers provide a Dept with the same benefits as non-CS hiring (already trained, choose who you want with no list, more experience) without needing to negotiate with the unions to leave CS. But the department seeking laterals needs to have something to offer that will draw people away from their current jobs. So you're probably less likely to see larger, better paying cities leaving cs, because they would have no trouble getting laterals.


Lateral transfers, in the CS system are required to complete the same examination as a new hire, (psychological *good for 2 years*, physical including drug testing and physical examination. The background varies from department to department, I have seen some very in-depth backgrounds that pull college transcripts and tax records and others are a simple calling of references and a BOP check. The main reason for leaving CS, is to hire who they want. For those bitching that they were on the outside looking in and couldn't get a fair shake because CS didn't count xyz, will now be paying $100 per town, trying to compete with Chief's favorites for a bite at the apple.


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## Pvt. Cowboy (Jan 26, 2005)

felony said:


> Lateral transfers, in the CS system are required to complete the same examination as a new hire, (psychological *good for 2 years*, physical including drug testing and physical examination. The background varies from department to department, I have seen some very in-depth backgrounds that pull college transcripts and tax records and others are a simple calling of references and a BOP check. The main reason for leaving CS, is to hire who they want. For those bitching that they were on the outside looking in and couldn't get a fair shake because CS didn't count xyz, will now be paying $100 per town, trying to compete with Chief's favorites for a bite at the apple.


I bet you're right.

I also bet LE hiring will slow down drastically, with all the anti-cop media so prevalent right now and for the foreseeable future. Didn't this happen in the 80's too? There was a large anti-cop sentiment. Some departments will struggle to fill their ranks. Hell, the MSP pissed through 1000 applicants to wind up with what, 230 left? Betting they won't even have spare parts for this class.

Isn't this one of the reasons the Quinn bill was drafted? To attract educated applicants to LE, and pay them a bit more? When the slow down occurs, what happens... They start up Quinn all over just to eventually take it away again? Pass.


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## SouthShoreBrother (Aug 1, 2015)

The civil service system is a burden for every city. Every other state gives veterans additional points on the test, mass puts them at the top of the list if they pass (has anyone ever failed that test?). That means that every city has to deal with countless interviews and bypass appeals of people that scored in the low 80's/70's. I respect service, but an additional 30 points? Dont even get me started on the consent decree aspect. Fix the system.


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