# Court Code 44 and "LIDAR" "Estimated"



## Frank Smith (May 9, 2013)

I was driving on I90 on the second half of April this year, and at that point I was on cruise control and the road was slightly slanted downhill. And it was a light drizzle. I did see the police car on the right and I moved on the second lane. He then came after me saying that I was speeding at 75 on a 65 mph road. Well, I was quite sure that I was not speeding, and not at 75, but what can you do?
He gave me a citation that I need to pay.
Questions: I am from Midwest, and my option was to pay the fine online, but my citation is not available. On the citation says "Court Code 44" - where is this court? Also, the policeman checked "LIDAR" and "Estimated". What does it mean? He estimated my speed? I have asked a friend, and he said that here - where I live - one can contact a lawyer to represent one in court; is it possible the same in Massachusetts? And how much that would cost? I am on a fixed income.

Thank you for your time.


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## niteowl1970 (Jul 7, 2009)

You should appeal it because law enforcement officers hate nothing more than being dragged into court. No need for a lawyer because 44 is Westfield District Court and as long as you act remorseful and tell them you're on a fixed income the ticket will most likely be dismissed and the Trooper will get his 4 hours of OT for 15 minutes of work. Everyone wins and you'll be able to tell all your friends that you stuck it to the man.


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## Frank Smith (May 9, 2013)

niteowl1970 said:


> You should appeal it because law enforcement officers hate nothing more than being dragged into court. No need for a lawyer because 44 is Westfield District Court and as long as you act remorseful and tell them you're on a fixed income the ticket will most likely be dismissed and the Trooper will get his 4 hours of OT for 15 minutes of work. Everyone wins and you'll be able to tell all your friends that you stuck it to the man.


Thank you niteowl1970 for your encouragement.

However, I reside at 1400 miles away from the court.
It would take me a couple of days to get there.
Is there any other option? My pastor told me that some states allow one to take an online class. This is my first ticket in 15 years and the last was because I parked too close to a water hydrant. 
Any ideas anyone? I feel so frustrated since I know I was not driving at 75 mph.

Thank you to all who are reading my note.


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## 263FPD (Oct 29, 2004)

If you do not want to travel to Massachusetts to appeal this fine, simply take the ticket, write the check, put it in the envelope that was given to you and mail it. Don't forget the stamp. All bullshit aside, and we can have lots if fun giving you sarcastic answers, that is most likely your best option. Our appeals process requires you to be present during the magistrate's appeal and then if you are still found responsible and want to appeal it to the judge, you will have to file a fee and return some time later. Yup. You can hire a lawyer to defend you. I don't see paying someone 200/Hr to defend a 100 dollar fine. You mentioned you are in a fixed income. My best advice to you is pay it. If you don't, next time you get stopped in Massachusetts, you will be wearing bracelets. Also, your license in your state may not renew because of this citation. 


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## Johnny Law (Aug 8, 2008)

Estimated means that the officer, in his/her experience, believed that you were speeding. Using this experience, the officer then used LIDAR to confirm their belief that you were speeding.

LIDAR is a very accurate and precise scientific instrument. At 1,000 feet the LIDAR beam is only 3 feet wide. That is about half the width of a typical vehicle. For comparison, if it were RADAR at the same distance that is about 300 feet wide.

I suppose you could hire a lawyer, but that would cost you more than the ticket itself. There is no traffic school or some other such class to take for forgiveness in this state.

No one yet mentioned this possible out. Was the trooper wearing his hat when he was issuing his ticket? If you hire a lawyer make sure to point out this discrepancy. Tell the lawyer to check the court case "Ragman vs. Comm. of Mass", which got many tickets thrown out in court because officers refuse to wear their hats when out of the cruiser.

For my uneducated brethren on this site who are interested Mr. Ragman's full name is Jos. Chitthe Ragman, if you wanted to look it up.


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## Guest (May 9, 2013)

Out of state? With any luck your state won't find out about it. MA doesn't find out about every out of state ticket..... 

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## Killjoy (Jun 23, 2003)

> No one yet mentioned this possible out. Was the trooper wearing his hat when he was issuing his ticket? If you hire a lawyer make sure to point out this discrepancy. Tell the lawyer to check the court case "Ragman vs. Comm. of Mass", which got many tickets thrown out in court because officers refuse to wear their hats when out of the cruiser.
> 
> For my uneducated brethren on this site who are interested Mr. Ragman's full name is Jos. Chitthe Ragman, if you wanted to look it up.


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## Deuce (Sep 27, 2003)

Cited for 75 in a 65? On the Pike??


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## Nightstalker (Jul 25, 2006)

Damn... Tagged for 75? I drive over 100 miles on the pike daily and if you are going less than 80 you are a hazard to other drivers. The shit is like Talladega! Im surprised that many troopers don't even give you a second look unless your in and out of lanes (or as I call it, being an asshole on a public way). 

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## 263FPD (Oct 29, 2004)

Deuce said:


> Cited for 75 in a 65? On the Pike??


Yeah. I call BS too.

I doubt anyone would waste their time.

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## 263FPD (Oct 29, 2004)

OP, according to your profile, you are 93

You shouldn't be fuckin' drivin' anyway. Two words for you "Immediate Threat"


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## Frank Smith (May 9, 2013)

263FPD and others respondents,

I am rather disappointed by all the negativity expressed in some of the replies.
Civility is a thread of one's character, and the lack of it usually displays a clear picture of one's personality. Studies attribute this compartmental behavior on insecurity due to improper educational standards, both institutional (formal) or familial (informal). I am sorry if I am offending anyone, but I am trying to understand one's attitude.

I have exposed the facts - including my unfamiliarity with Massachusetts judicial procedures - in order to seek advice from a forum presumably visited by professionals related to the subject matter. 

I was driving LESS the 75 mph. That is a fact. I was stopped and issued a ticket. That is another fact. And I have also presented details of the event and from the citation itself. More facts. Doubting my story is normal. "Dubito, ergo cogito, ergo sum" ("I doubt, therefore I think, therefore I am"). Rudely attacking is inappropriate.

It's a matter of principle: my age is irrelevant. I am fully capable of driving - both physically and mentally. I am a retired physics professor and I swim at YMCA five days a week for 90 minutes non-stop (how many of you can do it?) and hike 2 - 3 times a week for 10 - 12 miles. I am teaching a "Discovery Science" class and I am active in my professional group being part of the editorial board on a couple of science journals.

Truthfully, I don't drive long distances very often. The reason for this unusual long trip was to see my younger sister who is in an retirement facility outside Boston due to her Alzheimer ailment. But I have planned my trip from Kansas to Boston accordingly, allowing many stops and driving only 100 - 150 miles at a time.

I apologize for my verbosity: I was rather displeased by some comments I have received and I felt quite frustrated.

However, I want to end on a positive note: I want to express my appreciation and gratitude to all the good people who took their time and offered me advice and information - THANK YOU!

As far as the citation, I have weighted my options and I have decided to pay the fine. I have also talked to my insurance agent and she told me that it should not be a major issue due to my good driving record.

Farewell to all,

Frank


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## Guest (May 11, 2013)

Frank Smith said:


> 263FPD and others respondents,
> 
> I am rather disappointed by all the negativity expressed in some of the replies.
> Civility is a thread of one's character, and the lack of it usually displays a clear picture of one's personality. Studies attribute this compartmental behavior on insecurity due to improper educational standards, both institutional (formal) or familial (informal). I am sorry if I am offending anyone, but I am trying to understand one's attitude.
> ...


You might as well tell your tale to the clerk at the local convenience store, for all the good it will do you.

Appeal the citation, tell your tale of woe to the clerk-magistrate, and if you don't like that outcome, pay the $25 and appeal it to a judge.

There was a Washington physician who spent over $100,000 appealing a traffic citation that was less than $200, and he lost in the end.


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## 263FPD (Oct 29, 2004)

263FPD said:


> If you do not want to travel to Massachusetts to appeal this fine, simply take the ticket, write the check, put it in the envelope that was given to you and mail it. Don't forget the stamp. All bullshit aside, and we can have lots if fun giving you sarcastic answers, that is most likely your best option. Our appeals process requires you to be present during the magistrate's appeal and then if you are still found responsible and want to appeal it to the judge, you will have to file a fee and return some time later. Yup. You can hire a lawyer to defend you. I don't see paying someone 200/Hr to defend a 100 dollar fine. You mentioned you are in a fixed income. My best advice to you is pay it. If you don't, next time you get stopped in Massachusetts, you will be wearing bracelets. Also, your license in your state may not renew because of this citation.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Apparently you missed my first response to your question. From all of us, "unedemecated" folks, have a nice day.


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## niteowl1970 (Jul 7, 2009)

Frank Smith said:


> I apologize for my verbosity: I was rather displeased by some comments I have received and I felt quite frustrated.


I apologize for that and on behalf of the membership and I'd like to invite you to the next Masscops "Ask A Cop Night" which take place at the Denny's in Chicopee , MA which is right off exit 5 on I-90.every 3rd Tuesday of the month. I have to warn you that the discussions on motor vehicle law sometimes gets heated.


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## 263FPD (Oct 29, 2004)

263FPD said:


> Apparently you missed my first response to your question. From all of us, "unedemecated" folks, have a nice day.


And by Have a Nice Day, I mean Go Screw Yourself.


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## Expendable-1 (Jan 21, 2006)

Frank Smith said:


> I was driving LESS the 75 mph. That is a fact. *Wrong PROFESSOR, that is an assumption. *
> 
> I was stopped and issued a ticket. That is another fact. *Now that IS a fact*.


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## Rogean (Mar 18, 2013)

Nightstalker said:


> if you are going less than 80 you are a hazard to other drivers


While I agree with this, I guess 85 is too fast?

(Hope it's not against rules to post this.. I blacked out important stuff. And I paid it right away cause I was guilty lol).


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## lofu (Feb 25, 2006)

As a retired physics teacher, you must be very familiar with the Time/Distance formulas. It's what the very precise laser on a LIDAR unit uses to give the oh so dumb officer on the back end a true speed. If the LIDAR said you were going 75, you were going 75 at some point that it was locked on to you.


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