# Boston Police union endorses Kerry



## Gil

Police union endorses Kerry
Cites honoring of picket line
By Andrea Estes, Globe Staff | October 21, 2004

Boston's police patrolmen's union yesterday voted overwhelmingly to endorse John F. Kerry for president, months after the Democratic nominee refused to cross a police picket line during the union's bitter contract dispute.

About 50 members of the Boston Police Patrolmen's Association's House of Representatives handed the endorsement to Kerry by voice vote after US Representative William D. Delahunt made a personal appeal. It was the first time the union has endorsed a Democratic presidential candidate, the union officials said.

''This is a significant endorsement, particularly if you go back to 1988," Delahunt said, referring to the union's controversial endorsement of Republican George H.W. Bush over the hometown candidate, Massachusetts Governor Michael S. Dukakis.

The union endorsed Bush again in 1992. The BPPA had previously endorsed Republican Ronald Reagan.

Police leaders said the union endorsed Kerry in large part because he honored their picket line outside a meeting of the US Conference of Mayors meeting in Boston in June.

They said the endorsement also proves false rumors that circulated during the union's contract battle that their threats to disrupt the Democratic National Convention were aimed at helping the Republicans.

A state arbitrator settled the contract on the eve of the convention -- even as union members prepared to picket welcoming parties for the nation's Democratic delegations.

''We remember our friends and those who stand with us," said BPPA official James Barry. ''The rumors that we had another agenda all through this fight were planted and had no basis in reality. This shows there was no truth to them."

Barry said yesterday's closed-door session was animated, but no one suggested endorsing Bush. A few members suggested staying out of politics and endorsing no one, he said.

''They didn't think the union should be involved in presidential politics," said Barry. ''I said, 'Like it or not, we are involved in presidential politics.' We had the spotlight on us during the DNC. He respected our picket line. That was said over and over again."

BPPA president Thomas J. Nee, who was present at the meeting but left before the vote, said the decision to endorse ''was not arrived at easily," but added: ''The Bush administration has not answered the call. Their record speaks for itself. He was absent for the grit, but there for the glory."

The National Association of Police Organizations, of which Nee is the president, endorsed Kerry last month. Campaign spokesman Michael Meehan said Kerry was ''pleased to have the endorsement of the police officers who know him the best.

''They know his record as prosecutor and his record putting 100,000 cops on the street. They know he's the best one to keep America safer and stronger."

''It's particularly pleasing to have him be the first Democratic candidate they've endorsed in decades, if at all," Meehan said.

Barry said the union will contact its 1,400 members and urge them to support Kerry. They will point out his history of supporting police officers, particularly his sponsorship in the early 1990s of a US Justice Department program that allowed for the hiring of 100,000 police officers, he said.

In his 20-minute address to the union, Delahunt said, he talked about Kerry's background as an ''aggressive prosecutor and someone whose priority is ensuring the middle class doesn't go backwards."

''I talked about his not allowing the middle class in this country to disappear," he said. He said he spoke about his own grandfather, a Boston police officer fired for union organizing.

''When he worked as a police officer the work week was 96 hours and there was no vacation or overtime," Delahunt said. ''There weren't any benefits. Today we see them disappearing. The Bush administration wants them to disappear," he charged.

Delahunt has been campaigning and raising funds for Kerry around the country.

http://www.boston.com/news/local/ma...endorses_kerry_cites_honoring_of_picket_line/


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## jimbo

when it comes to an individual at the voting booth, I suspect the vast majority of police officers will vote for President Bush - despite who their union endorses.


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## mpd61

Gotta Love it!

Guy honors a picket line during the DNC (like he would dare cross it with the nat'l media present?) but F*CKS the Florida cops by crossing that line? Let's not forget his being against H.R. 218 (Law Enforcement Officers Safety Act)
:shock: 
Thanks again to the sell-out union officers for not looking at the entire scope of a candidate, and for not polling the rank and file that they supposedly "represent"
:uc:


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## dcs2244

Hey, if the union endorsed GWB and Mr. Kerry won the election...pay-back is a female dog! Don't believe this arrogant, pompous, egotistical, bloated puss bag wouldn't punish the BPPA...better to have not endorsed, than to have endorsed at all...


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## jimbo

only girlie men vote for democ rats


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## masstony

How can you be a cop and support such a liberal, communist idiot like Kerry? Rude awakening coming Nov. 2 for any union that supports that loser.


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## Dan H

Man, I wish my debate skills were as good as they used to be; Two guys near me in my academy are Pro-Kerry. Both go for the "lessor of two evils" explanation and one is really bent out of shape on Bush letting the AWB sunset. What I can't really believe is that they say the voting choice is clear if you want to get a job in this field...... That's what I think too that's why I'm voting for Bush!!!!! Who's been misinformed here?


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## masstony

Dan H , I feel bad for where ever those two Kerry supporters in your academy end up working, sounds to me they will be two shaky/liberal PO's, not what our job needs.


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## dcs2244

Dan,

Remember who they are: they will be the ones seeking to advance through politics (job and the other kind)...I wouldn't trust them. There is no serious street cop that can support Mr. Kerry, only "posers" (you know the type...all-show-and-no-go).


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## soxrock75

I would probably guess that most of the rank and file of the BPD and BPPA are squarely behind President Bush. Unfortunately, the BPPA is doing the honorable thing by standing by Kerry as he honored their picket lines. Kerry probably told the BPPA that he would fight for them with Menino and try and get the contract that they deserved as long as they don't disrupt his "coronation" at the DNC and endorse him. Looking at Kerry's track record and "me first" attitude, something tells me that once he locked up the BPPA endorsement, he forgot all about them. They get forced into arbitration and ultimately got less than what they wanted or deserved. Just like Kerry, he got what he wanted and the little guy that helped him got shafted and pushed aside in the end. God help us if we wake up on November 3rd and hear the worst words possible: President Elect Kerry.

BUSH /CHENEY 2004​


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## Killjoy

> if we wake up on November 3rd and hear the worst words possible: President Elect Kerry.


Just reading those words makes me sick to my stomach.....if that happens, might as well run up the ol' surrender flag at the white house!


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## MarkBoston

XX XX XX.


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## mpd61

Yes Mark!
:wink: 
Tell it like it is Buddy!


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## mkpnt

Killjoy @ Mon Oct 25 said:


> if we wake up on November 3rd and hear the worst words possible: President Elect Kerry.
> 
> 
> 
> Just reading those words makes me sick to my stomach.....if that happens, might as well run up the ol' surrender flag at the white house!
Click to expand...

If Kerry gets elected you might as well call us France!!!!


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## dcs2244

If Mr. Kerry wins: Gentlemen...start your beards! Ladies...start your burkas!

The war could be lost November 2...


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## mkpnt

dcs2244 @ Mon Oct 25 said:


> If Mr. Kerry wins: Gentlemen...start your beards! Ladies...start your burkas!
> 
> The war could be lost November 2...


In some states they are already casting early ballots...and from what was said on the Jay Severn show, they are heavily in Kerry's favor... so far. Can you say VOTER FRAUD!!!!!!!!


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## Dan H

dcs2244 @ Mon Oct 25 said:


> If Mr. Kerry wins: Gentlemen...start your beards! Ladies...start your burkas!
> 
> The war could be lost November 2...


 For the sake of all the men and women in the service right now, I hope to hell GW wins. I can't believe Kerry touts himself as a war hero and that is going to help him change everything in Iraq. I think the way his plan will go the casualties will jump up and so will the cost.


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## dcs2244

Mr. Kerry will do what he did in 'Nam: Support the troops for four months and then stab them in the back.


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## ADG0911

All cops should vote for Kerry........he has NEVER crossed a picket line. Just like he didn't cross the BPD picket line prior to the DNC.


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## dcs2244

According to reports, he did cross a police picket in Florida...


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## VTCOP

ooooo big deal, he didn't cross the picket line at the DNC. Is there any other reason to vote for him????????


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## Officer Dunngeon

ADG0911 @ 26 Oct 2004 16:53 said:


> All cops should vote for Kerry........he has NEVER crossed a picket line. Just like he didn't cross the BPD picket line prior to the DNC.


Can you please state at least 5 good reasons why police officers should vote for Kerry? The picket line reason has been disqualified, not that it was good anyway. 5 GOOD, SOLID reasons...


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## soxrock75

[quote="
Can you please state at least 5 good reasons why police officers should vote for Kerry? The picket line reason has been disqualified, not that it was good anyway. 5 GOOD, SOLID reasons...[/quote]

WOw, 5 good reasons? I think most people would be hard pressed to come up with only 1 good reason and most people would say it's because he is anyone but Bush. Seriously, this goes to show you how [email protected]#$'d up liberals and Democrats are. They are so petty and spiteful that they would vote for someone that they themselves admittedly don't like just because they hate Bush even more. What are they thinking?


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## Guest

Send him out here. I'll take Kerry on a tour of the Hoosic Tunnel, right about the time a train is scheduled!
:lol:


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## dcs2244

A tour of the "central shaft" might be more efficient... 8)


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## mkpnt

Officer Dunngeon @ Tue Oct 26 said:


> ADG0911 @ 26 Oct 2004 16:53 said:
> 
> 
> 
> Can you please state at least 5 good reasons why police officers should vote for Kerry? The picket line reason has been disqualified, not that it was good anyway. 5 GOOD, SOLID reasons...
> 
> 
> 
> I can give you 5 solid reasons* NOT* to vote for Kerry:
> 
> 1. *Kerry will increase taxes*. "He never met a tax he didn't like." Human Events Aug. 30th
> 
> 2.*Kerry is weak on defense*. He voted against the B-2 bomber, National Missile Defense, MX missle funding, Contra Aid, and worst of all Protecting our troops from international criminal courts.
> He voted for a 7 year freeze in defense spending and for the war in Iraq but against the $87 Billion to pay for it.
> 
> 3.*Kerry has constantly voted against funding U.S. Intelligence*. He voted to cut $6 billion from the Intelligence Budget in 94, 1.5 billion in 96/97, and he cut $80 million from the F.B.I. in 95.
> 
> 4. *Kerry is anti-2nd amendment*. He voted for the Feinstein Semi-Auto Ban, Federal Firearms Registry, Brady Bill, and the Federal prohibition of concealed weapons for self-defense.
> *"I think you ought to tax all ammunition more, personally. I think you ought to tax guns." **John Kerry on CNN's Late Edition Nov. 1993 *
> 
> 5.* Kerry supports partial birth abortion*. He voted against the ban on partial birth abortion and that should be enough of a reason for anyone to vote against him.
Click to expand...


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## Officer Dunngeon

You don't have to convince me... I just wanted to see if the liberals can for once back up their charge of "Vote for Kerry!" or "If you have a brain in your head, you'll vote for Kerry!" Boy, that last one really makes me wanna switch right over! :roll:


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## -=PNPS=-Rent-A-Cop

Let's just hope that the fine men and women of the Boston Police Department make an educated choice and do not just vote for Kerry based on their Union's endorsement. 

If they are in the know about Kerry, they will vote for Bush anyway. 

I know I would.


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## Killjoy

Voting for Kerry = Voting for terrorists


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## ADG0911

*To: Officer Dunnegeon and "Sergeant"*

You guys are obviously work for a non union department (which means it is not a real dept.) or are scabs. If you were union you would understand. If you are a scab then you don't care about anyone but yourself.


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## dcs2244

The members of this board that I know are union members. So am I. 

Perhaps if some can allow their political knowledge to mature, we could have a meaningful discussion of our political differences.

If, however, we insist on using our fourth grade teachers definition: "...democrats are for the little guy and republicans are for big business...", any discussion becomes pointless.

In case some haven't noticed it: both parties have changed over the past fifty years. FDR, Truman, and JFK would not find a home in todays "democratic" party...the party of special interests, trial lawyers and loafers. One need only look at where the parties get there money: democrats get theirs from the rich and PACS; republicans get the bulk of their money through the contributions of individuals like you and I.


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## HousingCop

*Makes ya sick, doesn't it?? *


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## mkpnt

*Re: To: Officer Dunnegeon and "Sergeant"*



ADG0911 @ Fri Oct 29 said:


> You guys are obviously work for a non union department (which means it is not a real dept.) or are scabs. If you were union you would understand. If you are a scab then you don't care about anyone but yourself.


*Sometimes you need to think of what is best for the country as a whole*. No matter what your Union says you have to live with the vote you make.

*Al Qaeda pretty much endorsed Kerry this week, that is all you should need to know!!!*


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## bdqadvisor

If any one of you had spent six months at the police academies in Baghdad and Irbil, you would never vote for a republican as long as you lived.


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## HousingCop

Last time I looked, all civilian security contractors in Iraq were there of their own free will. And getting paid quite handsomely to boot. 

Nowhere have I ever seen people being forced to sign at gunpoint at US Armed Forces stations. People in the military knew this could happen &amp; if they didn't plan for it, well too bad. While I feel bad for their families and them while they are away, they will reap the benefits of being a vet when they return home or honorably retire with 20 years in. Something I will not get since I never joined up. I knew what was expected of me if I joined so I never did. 

I plan on voting tomorrow for GWB. His unfaltering leadership is an inspiration, unlike the pancake Kerry, flopping whichever way the polls blow. Ask yourself this question......which President ever has given a check for $600 and $800 for working families with children? GWB has done this in the last 2 years respectively. 

I am a Democrat and have voted Republican the last 4 election cycles for President because I can see the havoc caused by the DemocRATic liberal elite that think they know what is best for the masses. Here in Taxachusetts, we have the 2 most liberal DemocRATS in the US Senate. They have tried to turn the US into a Gimme' State. Everybody's hand is out &amp; the Republicans put a stop to it. Fat Teddy's liberal admissions policys allowed terrorists to enter this country, live among us, &amp; take down the WTC on 9-11. 

Vote GWB tomorrow &amp; save yourself the headaches of a Kerry administration. HC


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## mpd61

Thanks Housing!!!

I missed voting for Bush last time cuz I was out to sea unexpectedly for NOAA. (too late absentee) Hope all you "real" supporters of Law Enforcement and the 2ND Amendment will vote with your heads
[-o&lt;

Posted 02 Nov 2004 09:38:

Thanks Housing!!!

I missed voting for Bush last time cuz I was out to sea unexpectedly for NOAA. (too late absentee) Hope all you "real" supporters of Law Enforcement and the 2ND Amendment will vote with your heads
[-o<


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## PBC FL Cop

Who, if anyone, did the Mass State Police endorse???? 

Florida PBA and FOP endorsed BUSH !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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## bdqadvisor

My post made no reference to pay (which was outstanding) or "force". What I was referring to was the incredible lack of planning and preparation that has lead to the disaster we have now. The Bush expectation was that the Iraqis were going to act like the French when Paris was liberated. His father certainly knew better. Then they pump in BILLIONS of our tax money with almost nothing in the way of auditing or tracking. Then they tell the Iraqi army to go home.

The degree of political incompetence you can see every day there is absolutely mind-boggling. And it all goes back to the Pentagon and the White House.

How popular and successful are we? My students favorite marching song translated as "We will cut off the hand of any invader who touches Imam Sadr". These were cops, who have since graduated and are now "protecting" their people.

Since the ballot has no "None of the above", I cast my vote for the man I hope can get us the Hell out of this festering sore, before another young man or woman pays the ultimate price.

While I have great respect for any argument in opposition to my opinion, comments about how our volunteer army knows what it is getting into are unconscionable. Before you say that, do a Google search on "Stop Loss". It is a draft, plain and simple. If your enlistment contract is up and you want to return to civilian life, you can't.

So slam me all you want, but keep your thoughtless comments about our young men and women in Iraq to yourself. Cause you haven't a clue!


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## robodope

Finally someone with information and logic vs. empty slogans about people being liberals..The war in Iraq is a complete disaster...Soldiers are being sent there to die while Al Qaida is posting videos on TV....and is growing stronger...I can't believe some of the nonsense I've heard..Only real street cops are voting for Bush or your liberal....I don't like Kerry or Bush, but I know Kerry will get us the hell out of Iraq...Let em blow each other up, and get out military out of there after Bin Laden, and protect our borders..I'm not a huge kerry fan but he will get us the hell out of there..As history has told us with Vietnam, and Korea..being involved in a Civil War which is whats going on there is a no win situation..Is it going to take 30 years again to admit we made a mistake....???Well we found no weapons but he was a bad man anyways...(good reasoning to invade a country?).I am pretty sure this conservative crap as is bad being a liberal...but what amazes me is we have a president who invades a country, lies about WMD, and there's no investigation...The Democratic President gets a blowjob from a fat chick, lies about it, and we spend millions investigating it for an impeachment hearing.... Some people need to come a little more to the middle..the water is fine


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## Gil

robodope @ Tue Nov 02 said:


> Finally someone with information and logic vs. empty slogans about people being liberals..The war in Iraq is a complete disaster...Soldiers are being sent there to die while Al Qaida is posting videos on TV....and is growing stronger...I can't believe some of the nonsense I've heard..Only real street cops are voting for Bush or your liberal....I don't like Kerry or Bush, but I know Kerry will get us the hell out of Iraq...Let em blow each other up, and get out military out of there after Bin Laden, and protect our borders..I'm not a huge kerry fan but he will get us the hell out of there..As history has told us with Vietnam, and Korea..being involved in a Civil War which is whats going on there is a no win situation..Is it going to take 30 years again to admit we made a mistake....???Well we found no weapons but he was a bad man anyways...(good reasoning to invade a country?).I am pretty sure this conservative crap as is bad being a liberal...but what amazes me is we have a president who invades a country, lies about WMD, and there's no investigation...The Democratic President gets a blowjob from a fat chick, lies about it, and we spend millions investigating it for an impeachment hearing.... Some people need to come a little more to the middle..the water is fine


Yes Flip Kerry will pull the military out of Iraq, :-k wait no he won't... :-k no he will, yes that's it he will bring them home, :-k no no hang on, he will not bring them home. :-k


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## HousingCop

bdqadvisor,

You signed on the dotted line & on the bottom it reads that they (US Gov't) can keep you over your enlistment period in a time of WAR which is what we are in as we speak. Or haven't you noticed? I took my job knowing full well that I can be called back to work, forced to work overtime on holidays, weekends, or the nicest sunniest day in the summertime. While my family enjoys a nice BBQ, I am sweating my @ss off humpin' hallways in the bricks.

I don't know if you are an original resident of Mass, but I can tell you, Senator "Flip Flop" Kerry is no bargain as a Commander In Chief. He systematically sold out his fellow soldiers who were dying in VietNam, secretly met with North VietNamese representatives in Paris France on his honeymoon while still serving in the capacity as a Naval officer and called his fellow soldiers "butchers". This my friend is TREASON. I believe it is in the Military Code Of Justice that an officer will not represent himself to a foreign power...........etc. And you want him in the big chair???

This is a guy that in 20 years as our Senator has had 4 pieces of legislation passed. Just 4. He thankfully has lost his bid for the White House tonight and his own home state gave him a wake-up call. See below;

*Massachusetts 
2004-11-03 08:07:33 GMT (i) = incumbent = winner = runoff 
President - 2150 of 2165 Precincts Reporting 
Name Party Votes Pct 
Bush, George (i) Rep 1,055,146 36.98 
Kerry, John Dem 1,771,381 62.09 *

Believe me, this guy is no John F. Kennedy. Hell, he's not even Teddy Kennedy. Now that he has lost he can go back to being Ted's designated driver.

robodope,

Well, if Saddamn didn't posess any WMD's where are they you ask? Wasn't a serin nerve gas shell blown up with a roadside bomb several months ago? Whoever made the bomb did not know what it contained. Both active ingredients did not mix well so there was no catostrophic contamination but the GI's were decontaminated.

Before the war, 14 seperate military convoys were seen going into the neighboring country of Syria. I bet they were just delivering Domino's Pizza. If Saddamn didn't posess WMD's then where is the conclusive proof that he destroyed them? Shouldn't 14 UN resolutions count for something in this world? I know that if I tell my kids to do something more than twice, a good whack is in order. This boob was given over a dozen chances to come clean. France didn't side with us because Chirac & that UN boob Kofi Anan have their hands in the cookie jar vis-a-vis the "Food For Oil" program.

Who do you think sold Saddamn his advanced weapons systems? France did. After the Frenchies dropped their rifles, Chirac sold them since Saddamn could at least use them.

Oh and by the way, tell the 5,000 Kurds that Saddamn has no chemical or biological weapons either. They might listen, but they are DEAD.

Tell the 1/2 a million, yes 500,000 people in mass graves all throughout Iraq that Saddamn should be in power. Yes, Iraq is a mess because there is a power vacuum once Saddamn was gone. There was no chosen successor except Uday & Quisey, and we know how swell those two were.

Tell the 5,000 Kuwaiti women raped by Saddamn's army in 1990 how good it was for them too. This guy was a madman & GWB gave him ample chances to do the right thing and let the UN weapons inspectors do their jobs.

At least GWB has principles and stands for what is right in this world. He's killed or captured 3/4 of Al Quada and the other 1/4 of them are s#itting bricks. He does what he says and thankfully he'll lead this counrty to another 4 more years. He's the *MAN*, plain & simple. HC


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## Guest

Endorsing Kerry is the smartest thing that any union in this state could have done. If he had won, they would have the president on their side. Now that we know that he has lost they still have a US senator on their side. That is a win/win for BPD, and the same would have been true for the Florida Depts, Bush wins president and Gov on their side. If he lost then the Governor would be on their side.


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## mpd61

lancegoodthrust @ 03 Nov 2004 11:39 said:


> Endorsing Kerry is the smartest thing that any union in this state could have done. If he had won, they would have the president on their side. Now that we know that he has lost they still have a US senator on their side. That is a win/win for BPD, and the same would have been true for the Florida Depts, Bush wins president and Gov on their side. If he lost then the Governor would be on their side.


Ahh...................

If only life was really that simple. Endorsing Kerry was a silly thing cuz he hasn't done anything for BPD before, and Bush and GOP congress could have done more for Boston ANYDAY of the week.
:wink:


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## bdqadvisor

Housing Cop, I don't know the source of your info on the "you signed on the dotted line..." crap. But if the same source gives you the lottery numbers, don't play them! In answer to your question-I lived in Mass all my life, minus the three years in Vietnam, a yaer in Bolivia, several years in southern Africa, and retired as an Army First Sergeant, CMF18, with three Purple Hearts. While there are huge gaps in my knowledge, military contracts are NOT an area that I am unfamiliar with. Your commitment is for 6 years. In a time of war, as declared by Congress, you may be drafted/enlisted for "duration plus" a period of time spelled out. Unfortunately, we currently lack a declaration of war.

Currently, soldiers on one year tours are extended time and again, because we were so unprepared for this. Soldiers who have completed their contracts are extended time and again, because we were so unprepared for this. Soldiers who have completed 20 or more years of service and want to retire are extended time and again, because we were so unprepared for this.

And the lack of preparation begins in the White House. Several old comrades have told me that they were pulled out of their Afghan assignments, ordered to clean up, get back in uniform, and assist in the preparation for Iraq two months prior to Powells speech in the UN. Their Afghan mission had them working with Afghani Northern Alliance warlords who were tracking OBL. With their departure, the effort to find him tapered right off.

As I said, disagree all you will with my politics, but God curse you if you criticize those who are serving in Iraq!


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## dcs2244

Citizen bdqadvisor, I am not at all familiar with the contractual obligations of military personnel, so please explain to me how Ted Williams was forced to serve in Korea after having served in the world war, part two? If memory serves, Korea was not a war declared by congress...


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## HousingCop

bdqadvisor

Let's clear up something right from the start. I have the utmost confidence in the troops, wherever they are deployed. They are the best equipped army on the planet. Sure, there is some drawbacks like having unarmored Humvees but you can thank Kerry for systematically voting against military spending &amp; research dozens of times. There is not enough bandwith on this site to dedicate to how many programs in the US military he has voted against in 20 years as our Senator. 

If the DemocRATs put up a half decent candidate, I am sure the election would be different today. Their ineptness has let Bush take the Big Chair.......again.

Another thing, are you over there as a US military official or agent of the US Gov't? Or are you a civilian contractor with police or military experience working for a private company training the Iraqi Police?? This would clear up alot of misconceptions I have had with your previous posts. Please advise.... HC


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## bdqadvisor

DCS2244: Last time I checked, it did not say GOOGLE across my forehead, but I do know that Ted Williams was a USMC Reserve pilot. He actually was John Glenns wingman for a while. I assume he was recalled to Federal service, as his Reserve obligation allowed.

Housing Cop: I am a retired police officer who is now working as a private contractor training the Iraqi Police. I originally was hired to open an academy in Irbil, in the Kurdish-held north. Once that was running, and due to my Infantry background, I went into Baghdad to work with the IA investigators there, to try and get them to stop beating confessions out of their officers, and to stop the methods they were used to using for punishment. I also was/am the lead trainer for the DOJ Train the Trainer course we do to train the military units that are/ were staffing academy training posts. Not to stir up pointless debate, but anyone here, up to and including the SECDEF will tell you that the lack of armored hummers and vest plates were not funding issues. The funding was always there. The shortages are caused by a decision made in the Pentagon, to space out the purchases over several years, and the three month delay in deciding to ramp up the same purchases as the attacks here increased. Politically, I viewed Kerry as merely the lesser of two evils, with a Powell/McCain ticket as the "dream ticket", but for all of his faults, the issues here have nothing to do with early senate votes. I know from the internet that the Congress had to force Rumsfield to accept a 30,000 man increase in active Army strength. Can't blame that on Kerry.

And your comments about missing barbecues and the like miss one key point: If at any time you get so fed up about missing these events, you can at least call in sick, or even quit. Neither of those options are available here. Hell, they can't quit here even when thay have fulfilled their enlistment contract.

Hope that answers your questions, and thanks for the kind words about the military folks here. Words can not describe the misery of their lives. They deserve our respect and admiration, and they earn mine each and every day here.


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## Officer Dunngeon

While I can appreciate the points you've brought up here, bdqadvisor, I still don't get this:



bdqadvisor @ 01 Nov 2004 21:08 said:


> If any one of you had spent six months at the police academies in Baghdad and Irbil, you would never vote for a republican as long as you lived.





bdqadvisor @ 02 Nov 2004 16:07 said:


> My post made no reference to pay (which was outstanding) or "force". What I was referring to was the incredible lack of planning and preparation that has lead to the disaster we have now.


I read your above posts and I understand the points of view you're trying to get across. The reason why people like you and thousands of other American men and women are in Iraq right now is because the rest of us can't be for one reason or another... completely respectable and much appreciated, whatever role is being served whether it be a soldier, volunteer or reporter. However, life goes on for us over here in the States too, and Bush, for most of us, was the better candidate for various personal and political reasons.

Maybe you're right, maybe if any of us did go through the police training over there we would all be voting for the bleeding heart liberals. However, I've been rereading these posts over and over again to see if there was some spot of information I missed, and I still don't see anything where it says that the police training in Iraq is other than voluntary. If one makes the choice to go over there and put themselves through hell, that's THEIR CHOICE. I've been reading about all the horrible things going on and how much everyone is suffering over there, etc., but to enlist to work in Iraq as a police officer in the middle of this conflict is not only crazy in my opinion, but would not change my political opinion because I made the choice to go over there and do that!

I can see where you're coming from in regards to the troops, I just still don't get the angle on your original comment.


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## bdqadvisor

Sorry, I thought my point was relatively straightforward: If not for Bush, we would not be in Iraq. We have no business in Iraq, Iraq had nothing to do with 9/11, and in going into Iraq, we curtailed our efforts to kill the people who DID have something to do with 9/11.

Once you spend some time here, and see how much we have wasted in coming here, then you can not view the government the same. At least, I can't, and neither can most of the people I work with.

That said, I am here with full knowledge of the risks. I like it, the pay is outstanding (and tax free) and I am getting the same adrenaline rush I used to get in an earlier life. Far more exciting than drunken domestics, barking dogs, and surly speeders. But I don't view any of that as a legitimate reason for my country to be spending its gold and blood on behalf of a nation that pretty much hates us. This place is LESS stable now than 3 months ago, and it was less stable then than six months ago. We know that the military and the police have been heavily infiltrated, and so it is safe to predict that three months from now we may look back at this as "the good old days". And the policy decisions come out of DC.

Does that make it any clearer? We have no business here. We had no business coming here. Coming here weakened our efforts to kill OBL. The prosecution rests.


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## Officer Dunngeon

As I said before, I understand your point of view. I get that if Iraq never happened, then the Americans wouldn't be there and blood wouldn't have been shed. My question is, hypothetically, why would someone who normally votes republican volunteer their efforts to serve the Iraqi police and then suddenly stop voting that way, assuming that they fully understand what they're getting into?

And I'm just curious, who did you vote for in the 2000 election?


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## jimbo

sept 11, the 1'st world trade center bombing, bombing the marine barracks, the navy ship, etc... enough is enough - President Bush did the right thing by taking the fight to those brutal bastards rather than letting them fight the war that they started against us in our cities and towns . Notice that there have been no more attacks here since we took the fight to where they live and train ????!!!??? Screw the turn the other cheek liberal democ rats - the radical muslims have zero respect for them and would have continued attacking us - sure, they may slip in a few more attacks on our soil, but let there be no doubt that we have thwarted many attacks that would have occurred had we not taken the offensive.... as far as the boston police endorsement goes - exactly what, over his 20 years in the senate has kerry done for the police ? he has always been more interested in media attention than in doing the right thing - i bet 90% of the boston police ignored their union and did what almost every cop i know did - they probably voted Republican - afterall, the democ rats are overwhemingly liberals who are historically no friends of ours - do not be fooled.


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## HousingCop

bdqadvisor,

You say that if not for Bush, you would not be in Iraq. If not for Bush invading Iraq, you would not be making the $$ you are now, tax free to boot. I am not begrudging you your salary since you basically earn every penny but you say that the US has screwed things up there to the Nth degree. Well here at home, it's not that rosy either. The military still spends enormous amounts of cash for a pipe wrench that can be easily bought for $15 at any hardware store. Did you think anything was going to be different over there?

OBL is not in Afghanistan any more. From intelligence reports, he's somewhere on the border of Afghanistan but on the Pakistan side. Why have 60,000 troops just waiting at the border for him to cross when you can have 50,000 of them kicking ass in Fallughah. They'll eventually get his turbaned @ss and his shortie AK will hang on GW's wall along with Saddam's gold plated 1911 .45 Colt.

*YOU *can quit that job any time you like as well. I need to feed & clothe my family as well as keep them safe & protected. I don't think Senator Kerry would have done as good a job as GW would when it came to keeping our streets safe and protected from terrorists. His record of voting in the Senate and his attendance at the various committees he was attatched to sealed his loss in my opinion. One can only call himself a *HERO *so many times when I have wounded myself worse gardening in my own back yard. A band-aid & bacetracin does not a hero make.

His liberal elitist philosophy along with his brides penchant for sticking her foot in her mouth cost him many votes throughout the heartland. Joe Bagadonuts cannot relate to a man who windsurfs and marrys women who are worth billions of dollars. President Bush comes across as an old friend who would sit down and crack a brew with you over steaks in the back yard.

Again, you say that things are screwed up there. How about your previous post within the Kurdish region? Would you call that a success story? Remember, these people you are training lop the heads off of westerners with as much ease as you would step on an ant. Remember, these are values & traditions they have been accustomed to for thousands of years. Did you think that their views would change overnight?


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## Officer Dunngeon

What he said. :dito: (Please insert extra "T" in sign.)

And I missed the "scab" comment earlier. I am a member of a union and let's face it... everybody on the job is always out for "themselves" in one way or another. You always want what's best for you and your family.


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